Question:

There IS a natural treatment FAQ that I don’t remember the URL for, but I’m sure someone will post it for you. However, and I don’t mean to be negative, I know VERY few people who can handle Migraine DISEASE without medications. Unless you have heart disease, have had a stroke, or have risk factors for one of them, painkillers aren’t considered by most doctors to be the first line of treatment for Migraine attacks anyway. They can’t actually stop the Migraine, only mask the pain for a few hours while you hope the Migraine runs its course during that time. Please keep in mind that Migraines aren’t actually headaches; they’re episodic attacks of a neurological disease. The headache is only one symptom. Some people have Migraines without ever having a headache. Your best bet is either an exceptional neurologist who really knows Migraine or an actual Migraine specialist. Good luck, Teri Robert, Ph.D. Migraineur * Journalist/Patient Advocate www.helpforheadaches.com www.headaches.about.com * MAGNUM Support Advisor www.migraines.org

| Hello. | I’ve suffered from migraine since I was 15 years old. | My migraine symptoms have been terrible year after year. | However, I have difficulty experience allergic reactions to | painkillers, so usually I can’t take medicines for migraine. Thus, | once I suffer from migraine, I have to be absent from class for a few | days. I’ve been very nervous about migraine since I started to go to | college, because even though I was absent from class only one day, it | was hard for me to catch up on the class. | Could you please give me advice about treatment for migraine without | medication? | | Thank you.

Response:

Hello. I’ve suffered from migraine since I was 15 years old. My migraine symptoms have been terrible year after year. However, I have difficulty experience allergic reactions to painkillers, so usually I can’t take medicines for migraine. Thus, once I suffer from migraine, I have to be absent from class for a few days. I’ve been very nervous about migraine since I started to go to college, because even though I was absent from class only one day, it was hard for me to catch up on the class. Could you please give me advice about treatment for migraine without medication? Thank you.

Migraines are not just bad headaches, although most times very bad headaches are one of the symptoms. The first thing to do is to make an appointment with either a headache specialist or a nuerologist to make sure what you have really are migraines. There are a few very serious things that can have similar symtoms to migraines that must be ruled out first. They are rare, but are serious enough not to take the chance with. There is a long list of preventative medications that can be very helpfull if what you have actually is migrane and they are frequent enough to indicate them. There are also a wide assortment of abortive medications that can be used. There is also the NTI Device from Dr Boyd. I’m sure some nice person will post the list of other helpful links. Welcome aboard, glad you found us, and sorry you had to. Bear

Response:

Hello. I’ve suffered from migraine since I was 15 years old. My migraine symptoms have been terrible year after year. However, I have difficulty experience allergic reactions to painkillers, so usually I can’t take medicines for migraine. Thus, once I suffer from migraine, I have to be absent from class for a few days. I’ve been very nervous about migraine since I started to go to college, because even though I was absent from class only one day, it was hard for me to catch up on the class. Could you please give me advice about treatment for migraine without medication? Thank you.

Response:

Actually, I think you need to understand and qualify your statements about low carb.  It’s not an issue of just low carbing and that will fix things. It’s an issue of getting the simple sugars and processed flour and foods out of your life.  I think laying out a blanket statement that people need to low carb and then pointing them to Atkins is irresponsible at best. Nutrition is a larger issue than that and we here at this newsgroup take a larger look at our health and realize it’s not a one size fits all approach. Migraines are a disease and are to be treated as such.  To minimize the situation by simply trying to prescribe an Atkins diet is belittling and obviously you don’t understand migraines. Michelle

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Err, no.  If it works that way, it’s because the diet eliminated migraine triggers for that particular person.  It’s not going to work that way for everybody. I started eating a high carb, balanced diet AFTER eliminating my dietary triggers.  There was no change in migraine frequency. I swear, LC diets are like a religion; you can find someone who thinks they can cure anything. -km, "If all you’ve got is a hammer, everything starts looking like a nail." Since you by implication still have some migraines, maybe you haven’t removed all your food triggers yet. Of course it doesn’t work the same way for everyone. But low-carb helps so many that it’s a very good place to start. Surely anyone with migraines should at least try this easy solution since it has very rapid effect. You can search usenet with google for people who have been very successful and plead with others try this method with groups.goole.com . http://atkins.com/Archive/2002/6/28-905283.html

Response:

I don’t have food triggers other than sulfites and aspartame, both of which I abstain.  Mine are hormonal…as in perimenopausal and such…I don’t think the elimination diet is going to identify anything I don’t already know. Michelle

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’ve been doing low carb for two years…no such luck.  I’ve not seen a good link between Atkins and my hormonally induced migraines. Michelle The next step is to get a cytotoxic blood test or try an elimination diet. http://atkins.com/Archive/2001/12/21-84989.html http://www.digitalnaturopath.com/treat/T137529.html

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Err, no.  If it works that way, it’s because the diet eliminated migraine triggers for that particular person.  It’s not going to work that way for everybody. I started eating a high carb, balanced diet AFTER eliminating my dietary triggers.  There was no change in migraine frequency. I swear, LC diets are like a religion; you can find someone who thinks they can cure anything. -km, "If all you’ve got is a hammer, everything starts looking like a nail." Since you by implication still have some migraines, maybe you haven’t removed all your food triggers yet.

Yes I have.  Maybe you haven’t considered the idea that food isn’t the only thing that triggers me.  My remaining triggers are not under my control, since they involve the choices of other people to drench themselves in chemicals that are toxic to me. Of course it doesn’t work the same way for everyone.

That’s right.  Some people run on carbs.  Some people run on proteins/fats.  If you put a person who runs on carbs on a LC diet, they will be just as miserable as when you put a proteins/fats person on a high carb diet. But low-carb helps so many that it’s a very good place to start. Surely anyone with migraines should at least try this easy solution since it has very rapid effect.

Not necessarily.  If you have liver or kidney issues, low carbing can be harmful. To address the OP’s original concerns, there is an option that hasn’t been discussed yet: auto-hypnosis.  I hesitate to mention it, really, since it doesn’t work for everybody, and responsible hypnotherapists can be hard to find.  Avoid the charlatans who advertise such services; what you want are responsible counseling psychologists who use it as an adjunct of therapy, not a primary tool. A good hypnotherapist can teach you how to get indirect control over the blood flow in your brain, which is what causes the pounding pain (at least in my case), and how to achieve a very deep state of relaxation, which will keep your other muscles from contibuting to the pain. I have been able to control migraines with auto-hypnosis without any medication whatsoever, although I prefer to use Aleve along with it (that’s probably just a crutch, really). There should be a local association of practicing psychotherapists in your area; that would be a good place to start inquiring about hypnotherapists. -km — Only cowards fight kids — unidentified Moscow protester the black rose proud to be owned by a yorkie http://community.webshots.com/user/blackrosequilts

Response:

Not everyone has food triggers. Teri

| I’ve been doing low carb for two years…no such luck.  I’ve not seen a good | link between Atkins and my hormonally induced migraines. | | Michelle | | | The next step is to get a cytotoxic blood test or try an elimination diet. | | http://atkins.com/Archive/2001/12/21-84989.html | | http://www.digitalnaturopath.com/treat/T137529.html

Response:

I’ve been doing low carb for two years…no such luck.  I’ve not seen a good link between Atkins and my hormonally induced migraines. Michelle

The next step is to get a cytotoxic blood test or try an elimination diet. http://atkins.com/Archive/2001/12/21-84989.html http://www.digitalnaturopath.com/treat/T137529.html

Response:

Err, no.  If it works that way, it’s because the diet eliminated migraine triggers for that particular person.  It’s not going to work that way for everybody. I started eating a high carb, balanced diet AFTER eliminating my dietary triggers.  There was no change in migraine frequency. I swear, LC diets are like a religion; you can find someone who thinks they can cure anything. -km, "If all you’ve got is a hammer, everything starts looking like a nail."

Since you by implication still have some migraines, maybe you haven’t removed all your food triggers yet. Of course it doesn’t work the same way for everyone. But low-carb helps so many that it’s a very good place to start. Surely anyone with migraines should at least try this easy solution since it has very rapid effect. You can search usenet with google for people who have been very successful and plead with others try this method with groups.goole.com . http://atkins.com/Archive/2002/6/28-905283.html

Response:

I’ve been doing low carb for two years…no such luck.  I’ve not seen a good link between Atkins and my hormonally induced migraines. Michelle

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Could you please give me advice about treatment for migraine without medication? Thank you. You really, really should try a low-carb diet like Atkins as soon as possible. Many people report that they stop having migraines in just a few days. There is no other treatment that I know of that comes close to this effectiveness, medication or no medication.

Response:

Could you please give me advice about treatment for migraine without medication? Thank you. You really, really should try a low-carb diet like Atkins as soon as possible. Many people report that they stop having migraines in just a few days. There is no other treatment that I know of that comes close to this effectiveness, medication or no medication.

Err, no.  If it works that way, it’s because the diet eliminated migraine triggers for that particular person.  It’s not going to work that way for everybody. I started eating a high carb, balanced diet AFTER eliminating my dietary triggers.  There was no change in migraine frequency. I swear, LC diets are like a religion; you can find someone who thinks they can cure anything. -km, "If all you’ve got is a hammer, everything starts looking like a nail." — Only cowards fight kids — unidentified Moscow protester the black rose proud to be owned by a yorkie http://community.webshots.com/user/blackrosequilts

Response:

Could you please give me advice about treatment for migraine without medication? Thank you.

You really, really should try a low-carb diet like Atkins as soon as possible. Many people report that they stop having migraines in just a few days. There is no other treatment that I know of that comes close to this effectiveness, medication or no medication.

Response:

Hi Kadee, I’ll bet you could just tell that you were that nice person I was referring to above, if not, you sure were. Bear Thanks, Bear. You’re a pretty nice person to. I love the humour you post. Kadee

I’ll put together another post of jokes later tonight, thanks for reminding me. Bear

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hello. I’ve suffered from migraine since I was 15 years old. My migraine symptoms have been terrible year after year. However, I have difficulty experience allergic reactions to painkillers, so usually I can’t take medicines for migraine. If you haven’t found the FAQ for ashm yet, it is http://www.meldrum.demon.co.uk/migraine/ Some good sites: http://headaches.about.com/ http://www.migraines.org/ http://www.achenet.org/ http://www.headachedrugs.com/ http://www.headaches.org/ http://ahsnet.org/ http://www.w-h-a.org/wha2/index.asp http://www.neuroland.com/ Migraine criteria http://www.upstate.edu/neurology/haas/hpmidx.htm Other types: http://www.upstate.edu/neurology/haas/index.html The Natural Migraine Treatment FAQ which Teri mentioned is at http://www.faqs.org/faqs/medicine/migraine/natural-cures/ As Teri mentioned, painkillers are not a good form of treatment and many of us find that they do nothing to help. There are a variety of treatments available but what works for one person may not for another. It takes time to find your own solution but many doctors will provide samples in order to find what works. Dr. Sandy L. posted the list of prophylactics he has compiled. If you can’t find it, I can post it again. You may wish to check out our archives at http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&group=alt.support…. Kadee

Hi Kadee, I’ll bet you could just tell that you were that nice person I was referring to above, if not, you sure were. Bear The first rays of dawn make the mushrooms scream.   I think with careful cultivation I can make them do "Ode to Joy".

Response:

Sandy L’s case; he is certainly not an "Unsympathetic doctor." Thanks Sandy.

I’ve noticed that, too bad he isn’t in my area Bear The first rays of dawn make the mushrooms scream.   I think with careful cultivation I can make them do "Ode to Joy".

Response:

I’m sure some nice person will post the list of other helpful links. I’m sure some nice person will post the list of other helpful links. Welcome aboard, glad you found us, and sorry you had to. Bear

Bear, Sandy L just did yesterday. It is down 14 lines (below your post) on my "Subject" (headers) list, and is entitled "Re: Stubborn Headaches, Unsympathetic doctors." It is dated 9/11/04, 10:47 AM on my screen. Nice reply, Bear. Incidentally, the subject seems to be unsuitably applied in Sandy L’s case; he is certainly not an "Unsympathetic doctor." Thanks Sandy. BobB —–= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =—– http://www.newsfeeds.com – The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! —–==  Over 100,000 Newsgroups – 19 Different Servers! =—–

Response:

Question:

My wife received for Christmas an expensive looking book with above title by a Henry C Lu  Ph.D who can be contacted at http://www.tcmcollege.com in Vancouver BC. I naturally looked up "psoriasis" and the only reference is shown below. As I am unimpressed with the results of conventional "Western" medicine for psoriasis, I thought it might be worth sharing with others what I found in the book. This is NOT a recommendation for the treatments but at least they are probably not likely to cause harm–unlike many derms "help". I believe the Hipocratic oath starts with "First cause no harm". Start of quote Treatments for Fungus Infection, Scald, Tinea Corporis and Psoriasis * Cut up and crush 250g fresh ginger and soak in 500ml of white (rice) wine for 2 days.    Use a cotton ball to apply externally to the affected region, several times a day. * Crush peeled garlic cloves: mix with sesame oil or lard to make an ointment. Cut the hair   in the affected area before application, once a day and apply externally region. * Mix 20g whole cloves with 70 percent alcohol to make 100ml.   Apply externally to the affected region. *Apply vinegar to the affected region, 3 times a day. Or fill a plastic bag with vinegar and tie   bag around hand overnight to heal greyish nails. *Boil a few eggs and remove the egg white;   fry the yolks until dried and burned;   mix yolks with boiling water so that yolk oil will float to the surface.   Cool it and use to rub the affected region. End of Quote I certainly find Apple Cider Vinegar to be useful             3/4 cup in a warm bath and soak in it for 20 minutes             One table spoon of ACV mixed with juice taken internally 2 times             per day I imagine the garlic cure would be best used by hermits only. Remember that "western" docs were using leaches until fairly recently! I personally use a Traditional Chinese Medicine Psoriasis Balm daily to good effect Good luck Chris

Response:

I personally use a Traditional Chinese Medicine Psoriasis Balm daily to good effect

Can this be purchased in the UK?

Response:

  I personally use a Traditional Chinese Medicine Psoriasis Balm daily to good effect Can this be purchased in the UK?

Sandy, Looks like 100% commercial Spam to me Visit the website and try and find what you want…..  Or, simply, don’t bother. Dave — Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).

Response:

I do not know about availability in the UK I buy from a TCM doctor in the Los Angeles area It is said to contain Rehmannia, Tangkuei, Coix, Rhubarb, Chrysanthemum, Licorice, Lithospermum in a petrolatum-lanolin ointment base. Maybe it can be replicated by a TCM supplier in the UK If you want his address, let me know and I will send it to you Good luck Chris

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I personally use a Traditional Chinese Medicine Psoriasis Balm daily to good effect Can this be purchased in the UK?

Response:

Remember that "western" docs were using leaches until fairly recently!

Actually, western docs still use leaches and maggots. Leaches are use when re-attaching severed digits, to help with blood circulation. Maggots are used on stubborn infections and gangrene. Both are very effective treatments. Cruiser

Response:

Question:

Hi Everyone: My mother has been struggling with asthma for about ten years.   She finally went to see an asthma specialist two years ago, and the doctor put her on Singulair(Merck).  This new drug really seemed to help, and after a year or so she claims that her breathing was better than in any time that she can recall. Last winter she thinks that the use of this Singulair may be the cause of an allergic reaction that she began to experience.  She noticed hives started to develop shortly after taking this medication, and so she discontinued her dosage.  She also reports to me that these hives were still present for one month after she quit the drug. After one year where she was not using Singulair, she went through a bad time with asthma.  Her specialist said that there is no evidence of a connection between Singulair and hives, and she is now planning to start taking the medication again. Do you think that these symptoms are consistent with an allergy to Singulair?  Does anyone know of cases where Singulair caused hives? Thanks for any help, Brad Before you buy.

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – My mother has been struggling with asthma for about ten years.   She finally went to see an asthma specialist two years ago, and the doctor put her on Singulair(Merck).  This new drug really seemed to help, and after a year or so she claims that her breathing was better than in any time that she can recall. Last winter she thinks that the use of this Singulair may be the cause of an allergic reaction that she began to experience.  She noticed hives started to develop shortly after taking this medication, and so she discontinued her dosage.  She also reports to me that these hives were still present for one month after she quit the drug. After one year where she was not using Singulair, she went through a bad time with asthma.  Her specialist said that there is no evidence of a connection between Singulair and hives, and she is now planning to start taking the medication again. Do you think that these symptoms are consistent with an allergy to Singulair?  Does anyone know of cases where Singulair caused hives? Thanks for any help, Brad

Hives would be a less common side effect of Singulair. See: http://www.merck.com/product/usa/singulair/cns/patient_info/effects.html Excerpt: "Less common side effects included the following allergic reactions including swelling of the face, lips, tongue, and/or throat, which may  cause difficulty in breathing or swallowing hives itching bad/vivid dreams irritability restlessness" Hives has many possible causes; sometimes a cause cannot be found. Ellis

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi Everyone: My mother has been struggling with asthma for about ten years.   She finally went to see an asthma specialist two years ago, and the doctor put her on Singulair(Merck).  This new drug really seemed to help, and after a year or so she claims that her breathing was better than in any time that she can recall. Last winter she thinks that the use of this Singulair may be the cause of an allergic reaction that she began to experience.  She noticed hives started to develop shortly after taking this medication, and so she discontinued her dosage.  She also reports to me that these hives were still present for one month after she quit the drug. After one year where she was not using Singulair, she went through a bad time with asthma.  Her specialist said that there is no evidence of a connection between Singulair and hives, and she is now planning to start taking the medication again. Do you think that these symptoms are consistent with an allergy to Singulair?  Does anyone know of cases where Singulair caused hives? Thanks for any help, Brad Before you buy.

Were the hives persisted for a mounth after she quit using it I would say your mother need to rethink that mounth. Hives usualy start to go away a cuple of days to one week after exposure to an alergin and are generaly associated primarialy with skin alergies. Par Exsample: Aloe Vera, great for most I’m alergic. Depending on the amount of aloe in a product I’m evposed to and the duration of the exposuer they go away anywere from 20 hours after to 5-6 days. The only lasted that long twice. The first time it took that long was with a lipstick My sister insisted I try that had aloe gell as a base componite that I had on for maybe 15 min (it actualy started to burn). The other time was whin I discovered I was alergic to nonoxanil 9 (little dose long exposer). The longest I’ve had a side effect from a med last after I quit using it was 3 days (I dont count the several month I went befor getting the hormon pills that restarted my cycle). If your mothers hives lasted for a full mounth then they were after she discontinued that they were probly caused by something she was still using for much of that mounth. A bath cleanser, laundry soap, ect ect. Look for the culprit amoung products that actualy have skin contact first. Elf-Kin

Response:

Elf-Kin I was given IV penicillin for 14 days in 1989 for peritonitis.  After I came home from the hospital I broke out in hives, so bad they ran together, and my skin peeled of.  I looked like I had a sunburn from the inside out.  The red hives stayed with me for almost a month.  Six months later I had a respiratory infection, was given sulfa based medication, again I broke out in hives, but not nearly as severe.   Both of these instances were from ingested substances.  I broke out in hives as a kid with an allergy to cucumbers! miclanjo – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi Everyone: My mother has been struggling with asthma for about ten years.   She finally went to see an asthma specialist two years ago, and the doctor put her on Singulair(Merck).  This new drug really seemed to help, and after a year or so she claims that her breathing was better than in any time that she can recall. Last winter she thinks that the use of this Singulair may be the cause of an allergic reaction that she began to experience.  She noticed hives started to develop shortly after taking this medication, and so she discontinued her dosage.  She also reports to me that these hives were still present for one month after she quit the drug. After one year where she was not using Singulair, she went through a bad time with asthma.  Her specialist said that there is no evidence of a connection between Singulair and hives, and she is now planning to start taking the medication again. Do you think that these symptoms are consistent with an allergy to Singulair?  Does anyone know of cases where Singulair caused hives? Thanks for any help, Brad Before you buy. Were the hives persisted for a mounth after she quit using it I would say your mother need to rethink that mounth. Hives usualy start to go away a cuple of days to one week after exposure to an alergin and are generaly associated primarialy with skin alergies. Par Exsample: Aloe Vera, great for most I’m alergic. Depending on the amount of aloe in a product I’m evposed to and the duration of the exposuer they go away anywere from 20 hours after to 5-6 days. The only lasted that long twice. The first time it took that long was with a lipstick My sister insisted I try that had aloe gell as a base componite that I had on for maybe 15 min (it actualy started to burn). The other time was whin I discovered I was alergic to nonoxanil 9 (little dose long exposer). The longest I’ve had a side effect from a med last after I quit using it was 3 days (I dont count the several month I went befor getting the hormon pills that restarted my cycle). If your mothers hives lasted for a full mounth then they were after she discontinued that they were probly caused by something she was still using for much of that mounth. A bath cleanser, laundry soap, ect ect. Look for the culprit amoung products that actualy have skin contact first. Elf-Kin

Response:

As everyone knows – There are the Hives and Hive Nots!   (Sorry about that!)

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Elf-Kin I was given IV penicillin for 14 days in 1989 for peritonitis.  After I came home from the hospital I broke out in hives, so bad they ran together, and my skin peeled of.  I looked like I had a sunburn from the inside out.  The red hives stayed with me for almost a month.  Six months later I had a respiratory infection, was given sulfa based medication, again I broke out in hives, but not nearly as severe.   Both of these instances were from ingested substances. I broke out in hives as a kid with an allergy to cucumbers! miclanjo Hi Everyone: My mother has been struggling with asthma for about ten years.   She finally went to see an asthma specialist two years ago, and the doctor put her on Singulair(Merck).  This new drug really seemed to help, and after a year or so she claims that her breathing was better than in any time that she can recall. Last winter she thinks that the use of this Singulair may be the cause of an allergic reaction that she began to experience.  She noticed hives started to develop shortly after taking this medication, and so she discontinued her dosage.  She also reports to me that these hives were still present for one month after she quit the drug. After one year where she was not using Singulair, she went through a bad time with asthma.  Her specialist said that there is no evidence of a connection between Singulair and hives, and she is now planning to start taking the medication again. Do you think that these symptoms are consistent with an allergy to Singulair?  Does anyone know of cases where Singulair caused hives? Thanks for any help, Brad Before you buy. Were the hives persisted for a mounth after she quit using it I would say your mother need to rethink that mounth. Hives usualy start to go away a cuple of days to one week after exposure to an alergin and are generaly associated primarialy with skin alergies. Par Exsample: Aloe Vera, great for most I’m alergic. Depending on the amount of aloe in a product I’m evposed to and the duration of the exposuer they go away anywere from 20 hours after to 5-6 days. The only lasted that long twice. The first time it took that long was with a lipstick My sister insisted I try that had aloe gell as a base componite that I had on for maybe 15 min (it actualy started to burn). The other time was whin I discovered I was alergic to nonoxanil 9 (little dose long exposer). The longest I’ve had a side effect from a med last after I quit using it was 3 days (I dont count the several month I went befor getting the hormon pills that restarted my cycle). If your mothers hives lasted for a full mounth then they were after she discontinued that they were probly caused by something she was still using for much of that mounth. A bath cleanser, laundry soap, ect ect. Look for the culprit amoung products that actualy have skin contact first. Elf-Kin

Response:

I did say GEneraly. last I checked generaly !=always Also, He didnt say Sever skin rash with hives and pealing, which was what ocured in your case. Whin one breaks out in hives it is best to look to skin irritants. Ingested alergins oftain cause the throte to swell, diarea, and the like. Air born alergins usualy cause itching eyes, snezzing, congection and the like. Were she used the meds for some time and discontinued right after the hives broke out it was more likly a skin alergy. Also, difrint types of hives take longer to heal then others. While everyone recognizes the little red spot hives one can sometimes have hives that actualy resemble ackne pimples (only they dont come to a head) They can be open or closed. In my experiance the open ones heal faster then the small ones.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Elf-Kin I was given IV penicillin for 14 days in 1989 for peritonitis.  After I came home from the hospital I broke out in hives, so bad they ran together, and my skin peeled of.  I looked like I had a sunburn from the inside out.  The red hives stayed with me for almost a month.  Six months later I had a respiratory infection, was given sulfa based medication, again I broke out in hives, but not nearly as severe.   Both of these instances were from ingested substances. I broke out in hives as a kid with an allergy to cucumbers! miclanjo Hi Everyone: My mother has been struggling with asthma for about ten years.   She finally went to see an asthma specialist two years ago, and the doctor put her on Singulair(Merck).  This new drug really seemed to help, and after a year or so she claims that her breathing was better than in any time that she can recall. Last winter she thinks that the use of this Singulair may be the cause of an allergic reaction that she began to experience.  She noticed hives started to develop shortly after taking this medication, and so she discontinued her dosage.  She also reports to me that these hives were still present for one month after she quit the drug. After one year where she was not using Singulair, she went through a bad time with asthma.  Her specialist said that there is no evidence of a connection between Singulair and hives, and she is now planning to start taking the medication again. Do you think that these symptoms are consistent with an allergy to Singulair?  Does anyone know of cases where Singulair caused hives? Thanks for any help, Brad Before you buy. Were the hives persisted for a mounth after she quit using it I would say your mother need to rethink that mounth. Hives usualy start to go away a cuple of days to one week after exposure to an alergin and are generaly associated primarialy with skin alergies.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Par Exsample: Aloe Vera, great for most I’m alergic. Depending on the amount of aloe in a product I’m evposed to and the duration of the exposuer they go away anywere from 20 hours after to 5-6 days. The only lasted that long twice. The first time it took that long was with a lipstick My sister insisted I try that had aloe gell as a base componite that I had on for maybe 15 min (it actualy started to burn). The other time was whin I discovered I was alergic to nonoxanil 9 (little dose long exposer). The longest I’ve had a side effect from a med last after I quit using it was 3 days (I dont count the several month I went befor getting the hormon pills that restarted my cycle). If your mothers hives lasted for a full mounth then they were after she discontinued that they were probly caused by something she was still using for much of that mounth. A bath cleanser, laundry soap, ect ect. Look for the culprit amoung products that actualy have skin contact first. Elf-Kin

Response:

Question:

I won 19 straight hands in a poker party among friends. It was so exhilarating that after the first 8 or so hands I didn’t look at my cards and just raised. Didn’t matter what game was called, I just left the cards lay as dealt. Of course that sucked all of the luck out of the rest of my life and I can’t even get 3 numbers on a lotto ticket in the last two years. Do you still have to pay for your good fortune 20 years later? There were about 8 people in the game if anyone wants to calculate the odds. **_**_**_**_**_**_**_**_**_**_**_**_** Jack Rodgers  <jrodg…@bellsouth.net

Think Silence… Enjoy the good times between the bad… ———- In article <1998090212372500.IAA08…@ladder01.news.aol.com

,

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -tonyje…@aol.com (TONYJEFFS) wrote:

Chance: If a penny comes up heads once, it is a 50:50 probability If it comes up heads ten times on the run, you start to wonder if it is a two headed penny.  The possibility of this happenning by chance is 1024:1

Response:

Before we get out our calculators:  what sort of refreshments were served and how often? :  ) MJ

Response:

Recently, research providing evidence supporting Gingko in the treatment of ginkgo by Dr Pavel Jastreboff, a prominent person in the tinnitus field. The research investigates whether ginkgo helps rats overcome tinnitus, with scientifically significant positive results. Put simply this paper says: A group of rats were trained to ‘paw’ their mouths (something they do naturally in the presence of food) when they heard a noise. The rats were all given tinnitus by administering high doses of aspirin. They were then subdivided into two groups. The rats in both groups immediately pawed their mouths in response to the tinnitus noise.  This showed that they all had tinnitus. One group was treated with gingko. The other group wasn’t treated at all. The group treated with gingko stopped the pawing activity significantly sooner than the untreated group This suggests that they benefitted as at  result of taking ginkgo. The difference between the two groups was so great that it was exceedingly unlikely to be a chance occurrance.  The conclusion is that  the gingko treatment was effective Tony Here is the abstract: Author   Jastreboff PJ; Zhou S; Jastreboff MM; Kwapisz U; Gryczynska U Abstract  The effects of an extract from Ginkgo biloba, EGb 761, on tinnitus were tested using an animal model of tinnitus.  Daily oral administration of EGb 761 in doses from 10 to 100 mg/ kg/day began 2 weeks before behavioral procedures and continued until the end of the experiment. Tinnitus was induced by daily administration of 321 mg/kg sodium      salicylate s.c. (corresponding to 275 mg/kg/day of salicylate acid) in fourteen groups of pigmented rats, 6 animals/group.      The results from salicylate- and EGb-761-treated animals were compared to control groups receiving either salicylate,      saline, or EGb 761 only in doses of 100 mg/kg. Administration of EGb 761 resulted in a statistically significant decrease      of the behavioral manifestation of tinnitus for doses of 25, 50 and 100 mg/kg/ day. ………………………………………………… My tinnitus site contains a lot of info,, some scientific reports and some personal accounts etc etc. http://members.aol.com/tonyjeffs/index.htm TonyJeffs Liverpool UK

Response:

In article <1998083123022100.TAA17…@ladder01.news.aol.com

, suf…@aol.com

(SuFein) writes:

How are we defining "significant" for the purposes of this discussion, Tony?

The accepted convention is that it must be  95% certain that it didn’t happen by cnance to be significant.   But most researchers prefer to opt for 99% certainty. I don’t know which standard Jastreboff used on this occasion as I haven’t seen the full paper. I would add that although this is a positive result, it t only at this stager applies to rodents with aspirin induced tinnitus.  It doesn’t *automatically* mean that ginkgo will help different sorts of human tinnitus, although it is hopeful. Chance: If a penny comes up heads once, it is a 50:50 probability If it comes up heads ten times on the run, you start to wonder if it is a two headed penny.  The possibility of this happenning by chance is 1024:1 Some maths: 95% probability that it didn’t happen by chance  means 5% probability that it did happen by chance 5%  = 0.05 Consequently in research papers you will often see the figures: P=0.05,  or  P<0.05 (Probability of chance fluke occurrence is less than 0.05) Tony Tony – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -

In article <1998083121194600.RAA03…@ladder01.news.aol.com, tonyje…@aol.com (TONYJEFFS) writes: Recently, research providing evidence supporting Gingko in the treatment of ginkgo by Dr Pavel Jastreboff, a prominent person in the tinnitus field. The research investigates whether ginkgo helps rats overcome tinnitus, with scientifically significant positive results. Put simply this paper says: A group of rats were trained to ‘paw’ their mouths (something they do naturally in the presence of food) when they heard a noise. The rats were all given tinnitus by administering high doses of aspirin. They were then subdivided into two groups. The rats in both groups immediately pawed their mouths in response to the tinnitus noise.  This showed that they all had tinnitus. One group was treated with gingko. The other group wasn’t treated at all. The group treated with gingko stopped the pawing activity significantly sooner than the untreated group This suggests that they benefitted as at  result of taking ginkgo. The difference between the two groups was so great that it was exceedingly unlikely to be a chance occurrance.  The conclusion is that  the gingko treatment was effective Tony Here is the abstract: Author   Jastreboff PJ; Zhou S; Jastreboff MM; Kwapisz U; Gryczynska U Abstract The effects of an extract from Ginkgo biloba, EGb 761, on tinnitus were tested using an animal model of tinnitus. Daily oral administration of EGb 761 in doses from 10 to 100 mg/ kg/day began 2 weeks before behavioral procedures and continued until the end of the experiment. Tinnitus was induced by daily administration of 321 mg/kg sodium     salicylate s.c. (corresponding to 275 mg/kg/day of salicylate acid) in fourteen groups of pigmented rats, 6 animals/group.     The results from salicylate- and EGb-761-treated animals were compared to control groups receiving either salicylate,     saline, or EGb 761 only in doses of 100 mg/kg. Administration of EGb 761 resulted in a statistically significant decrease     of the behavioral manifestation of tinnitus for doses of 25, 50 and 100 mg/kg/ day. ………………………………………………… My tinnitus site contains a lot of info,, some scientific reports and some personal accounts etc etc. http://members.aol.com/tonyjeffs/index.htm

TonyJeffs Liverpool UK

Response:

To those of you who may be taking Ginko: I took Ginko daily for about three months. Although I cannot attribute any reductoin in my tinnitus to the Gingo, I experienced a mild increase in blood pressure as a side affect. My blood pressure has always been normal(120/80), however, after taking Gingo my readngs were around 140/100. Since stopping the Gingo , my blood pressure is back to normal.

Response:

Richard said "I took Ginko daily for about three months. Although I cannot attribute any reductoin in my tinnitus to the Gingo, I experienced a mild increase in blood pressure as a side affect. My blood pressure has always been normal(120/80), however, after taking Gingo my readngs were around 140/100. Since stopping the Gingo , my blood pressure is back to normal." I’ve had a totally different experience. Ginko has not affected my blood pressure at all. I find that with good exercise, ginko, good diet…and the right amount and kind of sleep…The T is much more controllable Mark

Response:

Hi all, I saw my specialist today and she recommended (mainly because we haven’t tried it yet) that I try Ginkgo for a while. I know that it’s supposed to be good for circulation etc, but she thinks it may help me with this pressure feeling that I seem to get in my left ear and left side of face. Can anybody enlighten me regarding dosage etc. In fact I’d be interested to hear of any opinions on the stuff !! Best regards Dave

Response:

I got this email after posting a similar question: Mick, back in mid-October you posted a query on alt.tinnitus asking about people with experience with ginkgo biloba.  You didn’t really get much of a response.  I don’t look in there very often any more, but I thought you’d be interested in my experience with ginkgo. I have been a T sufferer for the past 20 years.  I recently saw some notes on Ginko as a T treatment, and tried it out.  My experience so far – almost 4 years worth – is that Ginko will often reduce the level of my T to 30-40 % of what it would otherwise be (an 8-9 db reduction).  It has become a tool in my bag for management of the T. But, you must couple it with management of other T instigators, too.  I also eliminated from my  diet many things that are known to be aggravators of T, including aspartame and caffeine in coffee.  Ginko cannot cope with these, and they will overwhelm the ginkgo effectiveness. You also must be patient, and be willing to experiment with the dosage.  It took several months for Ginko to become effective for me.  I also had to fiddle around with the dosing regimen to find a dosage and administration interval that worked. There are a dozen or so formulations of Ginko on the market.  You’ll find them in the health food or holistic section of your drug store.  OSCO is a good store for this, as is GNC.  I have a  collection of eight different brands, and I have evaluated each for effectiveness.  Their formulations are mostly similar.  A 24% concentration is standard, but the number of milligrams per capsule varies.  I’m now taking a 60 mg capsule by GNC that contains a combination of ginkgo, gotu kola, ginseng and lecithin.  It seems the most effective of those I’ve taken so far.  The GNC formulation seems most effective and cost effective. I also suffer from occasional bouts of hyperacusis, and so far the Ginko has no effect on this.  Aspartame seems to be the major instigator for this. I take two Ginko capsules in the morning, and have found this to be most effective for me.  If I take one in the morning and another at night it is not so effective.  I recommend you experiment with the dosage to find the one best for you.  One lady here on the list suffered side effects from her Ginko, but I believe this was due to too high a dose.  I weigh 200 lbs and 100 MG once a day seems OK for me.  Adjust yours up or down according to your body weight as a starter. Good luck, and let us know how it goes. Dick ==== in article 92teji$mm…@plutonium.btinternet.com, Dave Tudor at Dave.Tu…@btinternet.com wrote on 1/2/01 4:46 PM:

Hi all, I saw my specialist today and she recommended (mainly because we haven’t tried it yet) that I try Ginkgo for a while. I know that it’s supposed to be good for circulation etc, but she thinks it may help me with this pressure feeling that I seem to get in my left ear and left side of face. Can anybody enlighten me regarding dosage etc. In fact I’d be interested to hear of any opinions on the stuff !! Best regards Dave

—–= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =—– http://www.newsfeeds.com – The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! —–==  Over 80,000 Newsgroups – 16 Different Servers! =—–

Response:

Hi Dave, Probably have AIED (immune-mediated) here.  Been on Ginko Biloba for 6 months.  120mg day.  Doc told me to double it for a while (240mg/day), safely and easily.  If no results in a month or two, then stop.  Until now, no positive results I can lay on the G/B.  In my short lived stint with this disease and in newsgroups, I have not heard yet of a positive for G/B. Doesn’t mean it does not exist, I just have not heard it. Jeff Berk, North Street, Michigan (the snow has actually stopped for a while!) Dave Tudor <Dave.Tu…@btinternet.com

wrote in message

news:92teji$mmt$1@plutonium.btinternet.com… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -

Hi all, I saw my specialist today and she recommended (mainly because we haven’t tried it yet) that I try Ginkgo for a while. I know that it’s supposed to be good for circulation etc, but she thinks it may help me

with

this pressure feeling that I seem to get in my left ear and left side of face. Can anybody enlighten me regarding dosage etc. In fact I’d be interested to hear of any opinions on the stuff !! Best regards Dave

Response:

In article <6ncamm$60…@news01.deltanet.com

,

  alle…@deltanet.com (Allen D. Bates) wrote: – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -

A friend dropped the March Readers Digest on my desk. It had a section on natural cures. Since I wasn’t here in March I’m sure you’all had some comment on Ginkgo. Another one of those cure alls. So is there a grief summary of anybodies thoughts besides nada. I know it must be zip/nada because we all are still groping around. Mine is back to marginal toleration after a raging flareup because of a cold

in

April. A really funny aspect of it is that as soon as I leave work it hits. Of course thats not accurate, it breaks into the consciousness. Then I deal with it on and off until sleep comes. And thankfully I can go to sleep with it merrily buzzing away. Good Luck to all PS, anybody try Ginkgo?

  Tried ginko, but had no results. All the literature I found on it (mostly natural health guides) said that it takes at least two weeks of steady use for any effect. I did two months religiously without a change. Could just be me, though. —–== Posted via Deja News, The Leader in Internet Discussion ==—– http://www.dejanews.com/rg_mkgrp.xp   Create Your Own Free Member Forum

Response:

I had good luck with Ginkgo for a while.  It took a few weeks to kick in, and really seemed to make a big difference for about 4 months.   Then, I had a global allergic reaction to it.  I would not want to repeat that.  There are worse things than Tinnitus. I was told to report it.  To whom? Steve

Response:

I’m glad to hear it. I’ve been taking Ginko about a month. Thanks for the report.                                     Uncle Carl- Miami Axelrad wrote in message

<1998071223474700.TAA09…@ladder03.news.aol.com

…

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -

I had good luck with Ginkgo for a while.  It took a few weeks to kick in,

and

really seemed to make a big difference for about 4 months. Then, I had a global allergic reaction to it.  I would not want to repeat

that.

There are worse things than Tinnitus. I was told to report it.  To whom? Steve

Response:

What were the symptoms of your global allergic reaction? Axelrad wrote in message

<1998071223474700.TAA09…@ladder03.news.aol.com

…

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -

I had good luck with Ginkgo for a while.  It took a few weeks to kick in,

and

really seemed to make a big difference for about 4 months. Then, I had a global allergic reaction to it.  I would not want to repeat

that.

There are worse things than Tinnitus. I was told to report it.  To whom? Steve

Response:

The Ginkgo allergic reaction was similar to an allergic reaction to penicylin or other drug.  My hand began to swell and I broke out in hives/welts all over my body.  I think it could have been life-threatening, except I had some Benidryl nearby, took some, and half an hour later, began to recover. Steve

Response:

On 1 Jul 1998 03:33:42 GMT, alle…@deltanet.com (Allen D. Bates) wrote:

A friend dropped the March Readers Digest on my desk. It had a section on natural cures. Since I wasn’t here in March I’m sure you’all had some comment on Ginkgo. Another one of those cure alls. So is there a grief summary of anybodies thoughts besides nada. I know it must be zip/nada because we all are still groping around.

I just happened across this NG today, so I’m also a little late with this post. Ringing in my ears was driving me crazy about 4 years ago.  Went to an ear specialist who told me I had 30% hearing loss in my left ear (the ringing one), and ordered an MRI, which showed nothing unusual.  I was to the point where I was having fantasies of using an ice pick to poke out my left eardrum if that would stop it.  I was waking up in the middle of the night from the sound, which was continuous, and getting louder and louder. Around the same time, I started taking Gingko-Biloba in the hope that it would help my memory, which seemed to be fading.  After a couple of months, I suddenly noticed that I hadn’t noticed the ringing for some time.  I looked again at some literature on Gingko-Biloba and saw that it is indicated as a treatment for tinnitus. I was extremely enthusiastic for awhile, thinking that I had finally found a cure, but I began to notice the ringing again later.  It was never as intense as it had been, though.  I got lazy about taking the G-B, and it got to the point that I would only start up again when the ringing started to bother me.  After a few weeks it always diminishes.  Sorry to hear that it is only effective for some.  I have never had any other reaction, and never noticed any improvement in my memory. For the last year, I have been using it pretty religiously, taking 3 of the 60mg 50:1 standardized extract capsules almost every day.  At this point, the ringing is what I would consider manageable (ignorable) most of the time, and there are long periods (hours) where there is no ringing whatsoever, and days when it’s so quiet that I really don’t think about it at all. I’ve wondered whether the coming and going is something that would have happened anyway in time. The ear specialist had nothing at all to tell me except "I know, it’s frustrating." I’m pretty sure that there is a direct relationship between the Gingko-Biloba and the reduction of the tinitus, however, since I have been using it off and on for so long.  During periods when I don’t use it, the ringing always gradually gets worse, until I start using it again.  After starting up again, the ringing always abates. I’ve been wondering lately why I haven’t heard more about this.  I heard that William Shatner had been considering suicide at one point it got so bad for him.  I have to admit I was getting pretty depressed myself.  Supposedly, Shatner uses a combination of mental training (to ignore the sound), and some sort of white noise generator in an earpiece, and it is now manageable for him. I guess the fact that it is not effective for everybody is one reason why it hasn’t been more widely publicized, but I’m sure glad it works for me.  BTW, usually when I read that something works for 30% (or whatever) of the population, it doesn’t work for me.  Too bad for the guy who had an allergic reaction.  Maybe it was the wrong brand, just a thought.  After all, the quality control of these herbal preparations is not as closely monitored as for prescription medicine.  With that in mind, I’m going to mention that I use Jarrow Formulas brand, just in case someone is thinking of trying some.  I have nothing to do with that company, except that I buy that one product of theirs at the health food store.  The guy there recommended it to me. The formula I use says it contains no wheat, yeast, corn, dairy, soy, starch, or other common allergen. Anyway, I was surprised there weren’t more glowing recommendations.  I expected to see a slew of posts reporting satisfactory results.  I’ve been recommending it to everyone I talk to.  I’ll have to be a little less enthusiastic now that I’ve read so many posts from people for whom it was just a waste of time (and hope).  Good luck to those who try it, and again, sorry to the other folks.

Response:

As far as I can tell, gingko is generally useless, and in some instances can cause bleeding. Cheers, Leonard { Please support the American Tinnitus Association: http://www.ata.org } "Never ruin an apology with an excuse."  –Kimberly Johnson     435

Response:

I’ve been trying it for two months. No change. Carl in Miami – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Allen D. Bates wrote in message <6ncamm$60…@news01.deltanet.com

… A friend dropped the March Readers Digest on my desk. It had a section on natural cures. Since I wasn’t here in March I’m sure you’all had some

comment

on Ginkgo. Another one of those cure alls. So is there a grief summary of anybodies thoughts besides nada. I know it must be zip/nada because we all

are

still groping around. Mine is back to marginal toleration after a raging flareup because of a

cold in

April. A really funny aspect of it is that as soon as I leave work it hits.

Of

course thats not accurate, it breaks into the consciousness. Then I deal

with

it on and off until sleep comes. And thankfully I can go to sleep with it merrily buzzing away. Good Luck to all PS, anybody try Ginkgo?

Response:

Yeah, I tried Gingko, didn’t work for me but it seems to be a very individual thing. Bye for now – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Allen D. Bates wrote:

A friend dropped the March Readers Digest on my desk. It had a section on natural cures. Since I wasn’t here in March I’m sure you’all had some comment on Ginkgo. Another one of those cure alls. So is there a grief summary of anybodies thoughts besides nada. I know it must be zip/nada because we all are still groping around. Mine is back to marginal toleration after a raging flareup because of a cold in April. A really funny aspect of it is that as soon as I leave work it hits. Of course thats not accurate, it breaks into the consciousness. Then I deal with it on and off until sleep comes. And thankfully I can go to sleep with it merrily buzzing away. Good Luck to all PS, anybody try Ginkgo?

Response:

A friend dropped the March Readers Digest on my desk. It had a section on natural cures. Since I wasn’t here in March I’m sure you’all had some comment on Ginkgo. Another one of those cure alls. So is there a grief summary of anybodies thoughts besides nada. I know it must be zip/nada because we all are still groping around. Mine is back to marginal toleration after a raging flareup because of a cold in April. A really funny aspect of it is that as soon as I leave work it hits. Of course thats not accurate, it breaks into the consciousness. Then I deal with it on and off until sleep comes. And thankfully I can go to sleep with it merrily buzzing away. Good Luck to all PS, anybody try Ginkgo?

Response:

Question:

If you have asthma, heartburn or digestion problems have a look at this   http://www.ultra.net.au/buteyko/asthma_heartburn_reflux.html It explains asthma and digestion problems from a different perspective. Regards, James In article <35610078.8BFF0…@preferred.com

,

  Gary Collins <coll…@preferred.com

wrote:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -

Joe, I also have asthma and did not get good results until the asthma was treated aggressively. That includes appropriate inhalers daily and possibly oral anti-inflammitorys for the lungs. If you have asthma and use CPAP the CPAP

will

cause the asthma to possibly progress into lung pain. I believe the weight thing in relation to asthma has two effects: increased effort breathing, and esophigal reflux which has a definite known problem

with

exacerbating asthma. If those are not a problem then it is probably a

matter of

how overweight are you? If weight has an effect for you you will probably

notice

a difference when you lie down.The increased weight on your diaphram will

make a

difference. By the way I hope the cigar thing is a joke. If it isn’t you’re doing

foolishly.

Gary RogerJ1 wrote: I have asthma as well. I’ve been on cpap for 2 months. Asthma isn’t

noticably

better. I read a news story recently about a link between asthma and

weight.

The same link applies to sleep apnea.  I hope to lose some weight now

that I

have more energy and ease symptoms with both problems! Roger W. Johnson Associate Vice President, Investments MSDW President- Gig Harbor Cigar Club No Spam

—–== Posted via Deja News, The Leader in Internet Discussion ==—– http://www.dejanews.com/   Now offering spam-free web-based newsreading

Response:

Hello my sleepy friends…. I wonder if anyone has asthma, and if so, did there asthma improve when they began using a CPAP machine for their apnea? Kathi

Response:

I have asthma as well. I’ve been on cpap for 2 months. Asthma isn’t noticably better. I read a news story recently about a link between asthma and weight. The same link applies to sleep apnea.  I hope to lose some weight now that I have more energy and ease symptoms with both problems! Roger W. Johnson Associate Vice President, Investments MSDW President- Gig Harbor Cigar Club No Spam

Response:

RogerJ1 wrote:

I have asthma as well. I’ve been on cpap for 2 months. Asthma isn’t noticably better. I read a news story recently about a link between asthma and weight. The same link applies to sleep apnea.  I hope to lose some weight now that I have more energy and ease symptoms with both problems! Roger W. Johnson Associate Vice President, Investments MSDW President- Gig Harbor Cigar Club No Spam

Roger: I have a weight maintenance program on my web site at http://www.cpapman.com.  Scroll down to Patient Education, then click on Weight Management.  It really works.  You can print it out and fill in the blanks.  Then you know what you have to do to loose weight and keep it off.  It is not easy, but, it works. –Joe– cpapman.com

Response:

Joe, I also have asthma and did not get good results until the asthma was treated aggressively. That includes appropriate inhalers daily and possibly oral anti-inflammitorys for the lungs. If you have asthma and use CPAP the CPAP will cause the asthma to possibly progress into lung pain. I believe the weight thing in relation to asthma has two effects: increased effort breathing, and esophigal reflux which has a definite known problem with exacerbating asthma. If those are not a problem then it is probably a matter of how overweight are you? If weight has an effect for you you will probably notice a difference when you lie down.The increased weight on your diaphram will make a difference. By the way I hope the cigar thing is a joke. If it isn’t you’re doing foolishly. Gary – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -RogerJ1 wrote:

I have asthma as well. I’ve been on cpap for 2 months. Asthma isn’t noticably better. I read a news story recently about a link between asthma and weight. The same link applies to sleep apnea.  I hope to lose some weight now that I have more energy and ease symptoms with both problems! Roger W. Johnson Associate Vice President, Investments MSDW President- Gig Harbor Cigar Club No Spam

Response:

Question:

I just saw a report on the local Baltimore, MD TV news that doctors in New Zealand have had a 100% asthma cure rate in mice when given some kind of an inhaled TB vaccine. Has anybody else seen anything about this? I remember seeing a study out of Japan a year or 2 ago about a link between kids getting TB vaccine and asthma.

Response:

Haven’t been able to find anything on the net precisely about that, but  http://www.wcinet.com/th/News/010397/National/41065.htm describes a study of Japanese children and their reactions to TB vaccines and subsequent development of asthma and  http://www.newswise.com/articles/ASTHMVAC.LRR.html describes a New Mexican researcher’s views (without references) on how this approach might work charlie – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I just saw a report on the local Baltimore, MD TV news that doctors in New Zealand have had a 100% asthma cure rate in mice when given some kind of an inhaled TB vaccine. Has anybody else seen anything about this? I remember seeing a study out of Japan a year or 2 ago about a link between kids getting TB vaccine and asthma.

Response:

I just saw a report on the local Baltimore, MD TV news that doctors in New Zealand have had a 100% asthma cure rate in mice when given some kind of an inhaled TB

vaccine. Has anybody else seen anything about this? I remember seeing a study out of Japan a year or 2 ago about a link between kids getting TB vaccine and asthma.

Here’s the information I found on this topic, if anything else becomes available I’ll post it. The address is http://www.nzdoctor.co.nz/mar13news98.html but at this stage there is nothing else there on the topic Renae Wellington breakthrough on asthma Wellington researchers have made a major breakthrough on a cure for asthma. Wellington School of Medicine professor Richard Beasley, also co-director of the Wellington Asthma Research Group says the work is one of the most important studies recently. It shows the anti-tuberculosis vaccine suppresses asthma symptoms and, if given early enough, stops asthma developing. Mice were given a mid form of asthma and it was found they responded best when the TB vaccine was administered directly into their airways. The results show potential for an asthma vaccine exists, Professor Beasley says.

Response:

Question:

Since having a major attack in Oct this year,I have noticed a significant gain in my weight. I was prescribed a daily dose of Becotide 200(Beclomethasone);2 puffs,twice a day. Could this be a cause of weight gain?My food intake hasn’t increased so I’m a bit puzzled and depressed! —

Response:

Since having a major attack in Oct this year,I have noticed a significant gain in my weight. I was prescribed a daily dose of Becotide 200(Beclomethasone);2 puffs,twice a day. Could this be a cause of weight gain?My food intake hasn’t increased so I’m a bit puzzled and depressed! —

This is 800 ug beclomethasone/day; a Medium-High Dose. It’s doubtful that this is involved; however steroids can contribute to weight gain in some, by stimulating appetite (there aren’t any calories in beclomethasone) Weight gain = calories in (food) – calories out (metabolism and exercise) Those on oral steroids (or High Dose inhaled steroids) may tend to gain weight, and a low carbohydrate diet is advisable, with lots of fruit, vegetables, and protein; low glycemic carbohydrates are OK, like 100% whole wheat bread, brown rice, oatmeal. And regular exercise, like walking, is essential. Ellis

Response:

however steroids can contribute to weight gain in some, by stimulating appetite (there aren’t any calories in beclomethasone) Weight gain = calories in (food) – calories out (metabolism and exercise)

Is it strictly appetite stimulatoin?  Can "metabolism" go down (maybe the patient ends up wearing more sweaters). I had the good (orbad, depending on how you look at it)  fortune to spend some time at the South Pole during summer.  The temperature while I was there was was typically 35-45 below zero F (-38 to -42  C). after a week, I noticed I was comfortable outdoors with far fewer outer garments than at first;  there was also an increase in food consumption suggesting to me that my internal heat production had gone up.  My physical activity level was fairly constant the entire stay. Anecdotally almost all the people who stay at the pole for an extended period (months) develop some sort of tolerance to the extreme cold, gain some weight and eat absurd amounts of food. It appears that the internal "thermostat" can be modified;  is it possible steroids can do this? — DON’T ‘RE’ this message.  I use a bogus address to thwart email harvesters for junk lists.  Reply on the newsgroup or respond David

Response:

I was on steriod medication for asthma and was told that wieght gain was a side effect.  I did not gain wieght though but it is possible.  Is it working?  If so, don’t stop unless you’re wieght is an issue as well.  

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Using, serevent, atrovent, pulmicort, and ventolin and prednisone (which I can’t ikeep down) to treat a severe asthma attack.  I have noticed puffiness, and bloating, and am so worried it will be weight gain.  I am ready to stop using this medication!  Am i imagining this?

Response:

Using, serevent, atrovent, pulmicort, and ventolin and prednisone (which I can’t ikeep down) to treat a severe asthma attack.  I have noticed puffiness, and bloating, and am so worried it will be weight gain.  I am ready to stop using this medication!  Am i imagining this?

No, steroids are famous for all the above–weight gain, puffy face, etc. There are diet strategies to minimize this, but if you are having severe asthma attacks, the weight gain is the least of considerations. Getting your asthma under control should be top priority.

Response:

Using, serevent, atrovent, pulmicort, and ventolin and prednisone (which I can’t ikeep down) to treat a severe asthma attack.  I have noticed puffiness, and bloating, and am so worried it will be weight gain.  I am ready to stop using this medication!  Am i imagining this? No, steroids are famous for all the above–weight gain, puffy face, etc. There are diet strategies to minimize this, but if you are having severe asthma attacks, the weight gain is the least of considerations. Getting your asthma under control should be top priority.

A couple of things I found that helped keep the weight gain in check was: water with fresh lemon juice first thing in the morning and reducing salt intake.  I’m sure keeping low calorie snacks on hand would help too.

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    I have just come down off a prednisone course. I have not avoided weight gain entirely, but I found that keeping something like animal crackers about to help with the munchies is a good idea. They don’t have much of anything to them, and don’t do much harm. I buy the 2 pound bags at Wal-Mart. Incidentally pred is so notorious for putting pounds on, some people call it "pregnisone"! Boyd — "The cure for boredom is curiosity. There is no cure for curiosity." (Ellen Parr- author)

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Using, serevent, atrovent, pulmicort, and ventolin and prednisone (which I can’t ikeep down) to treat a severe asthma attack.  I have noticed puffiness, and bloating, and am so worried it will be weight gain.  I am ready to stop using this medication!  Am i imagining this? No, steroids are famous for all the above–weight gain, puffy face, etc. There are diet strategies to minimize this, but if you are having severe asthma attacks, the weight gain is the least of considerations. Getting your asthma under control should be top priority. A couple of things I found that helped keep the weight gain in check was: water with fresh lemon juice first thing in the morning and reducing salt intake.  I’m sure keeping low calorie snacks on hand would help too.

Response:

Using, serevent, atrovent, pulmicort, and ventolin and prednisone (which I can’t ikeep down) to treat a severe asthma attack.  I have noticed puffiness, and bloating, and am so worried it will be weight gain.  I am ready to stop using this medication!  Am i imagining this?

No, these are common side effects of prednisone.  However – you were prescribed the pred for a reason.  Before you decide to drop it – Talk To Your Doctor. "Keep looking below surface appearances. Don’t shrink from doing so (just) because you might not like what you find."    General Colin Powell

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Goatmilk: about half a cup  per 20 mgs

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I have athree year old daughter. She is 65ponds and Ive tryed everything. The doctors say she will be on these meds for the rest of her life. When I dont give them to her she gets put in the hosptal, I understand

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I just finished a five week taper on Prednisone… I kept granola bars handy, cut the salt and upped my water intake. Net result is that I actually lost a couple of pounds. Also for the first time ever, (three days ago), I hit a little over 800 on my peak flow (three times).  The day started at 590, went to 650 and then 800. Down to 550 the next AM though. Do you ever get odd peak flows like that? (not that I’m complaining… Just curious) Dan Rhea "Loyalty is for family, friends and country, not operating systems, compilers and computers"   – Dan Rhea, 1986

    I have just come down off a prednisone course. I have not avoided weight gain entirely, but I found that keeping something like animal crackers about to help with the munchies is a good idea. They don’t have much of anything to them, and don’t do much harm. I buy the 2 pound bags at Wal-Mart. Incidentally pred is so notorious for putting pounds on, some people call it "pregnisone"! Boyd

<snip

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Well, since switching to singulaire I have *lost* weight – mostly because I’m more active now that my asthma is completely under control. Loki – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Yes!  I thought it was me!  I’ve gained 10 pounds or so since I went on Singulair late last Spring – most of it in the first 10 weeks, which would have been over the Summer.  And I can’t shake the extra weight, no matter what I do! I’ve checked the side effects of Singulair and I don’t see "weight gain" anywhere, but is it possible?  (whoa! sign me back up for Accolate!) Catherine

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I’ve gained 10 lb. since going on Singulair last summer. Also notice it seems to make me need more sleep, so I’ve cut back to taking every other day. I doubt there is a direct connection to weight gain, tho better asthma control might mean less energy expended trying to breath. Or less need for bronchodilators, which tend to increase metabolism and cause weight loss. I’ve read of some going on albuterol to lose weight. Ellis – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Yes!  I thought it was me!  I’ve gained 10 pounds or so since I went on Singulair late last Spring – most of it in the first 10 weeks, which would have been over the Summer.  And I can’t shake the extra weight, no matter what I do! I’ve checked the side effects of Singulair and I don’t see "weight gain" anywhere, but is it possible?  (whoa! sign me back up for Accolate!) Catherine Had my meds switched from accolate and xantac to singulair and prilosec about 10 weeks ago.  I have experienced a gratifying improvement in my asthma.  Now use serevent usually only once a day, no more flovent, vancenase or duravent.  Interestingly I’ve gained about 12 pounds in the same time period although I’ve not changed my eating habits or exercise regimen in any way.  Has any one else had a similar experience with prilosec or singulair?

Response:

Had my meds switched from accolate and xantac to singulair and prilosec about 10 weeks ago.  I have experienced a gratifying improvement in my asthma.  Now use serevent usually only once a day, no more flovent, vancenase or duravent.  Interestingly I’ve gained about 12 pounds in the same time period although I’ve not changed my eating habits or exercise regimen in any way.  Has any one else had a similar experience with prilosec or singulair?

Response:

Yes!  I thought it was me!  I’ve gained 10 pounds or so since I went on Singulair late last Spring – most of it in the first 10 weeks, which would have been over the Summer.  And I can’t shake the extra weight, no matter what I do! I’ve checked the side effects of Singulair and I don’t see "weight gain" anywhere, but is it possible?  (whoa! sign me back up for Accolate!) Catherine – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Had my meds switched from accolate and xantac to singulair and prilosec about 10 weeks ago.  I have experienced a gratifying improvement in my asthma.  Now use serevent usually only once a day, no more flovent, vancenase or duravent.  Interestingly I’ve gained about 12 pounds in the same time period although I’ve not changed my eating habits or exercise regimen in any way.  Has any one else had a similar experience with prilosec or singulair?

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IBeware ‘low-fat’ convenience foods.  If you read the label the proportion of fat to carbohydrates often makes it clear that far too many of the calories in it come from fat.  1g fat yields twice as many calories as 1g starch.

Another reason to avoid "low-fat" convience foods is that many of them are quite high in sodium content.  There are many natural "low-fat" convience foods that come in their own packaging and are easy to store and carry with you….fruits. Add a healthy dose of vegetables and reduce your meat and you have a healthier diet.  BTW, did you know that if you are very hungry and just can’t wait for supper, an orange will curb your hunger longer than other fruits! Janine

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I was put on to a fairly lengthy course of prednisalone when I was diagnosed with adult onset asthma just on 3 years ago. (A total of 3.5 months out of 6). During that period I gained 28 (repeat 28) lbs which are still stibbornly with me.  My exercise patterns are terrible – I am frightened at times even to walk the block in case I get an attack.  Anyone else with weight problems???  I would like to hear what others do about weight management (I am 55). Trevor

Response:

I was put on to a fairly lengthy course of prednisalone when I was diagnosed with adult onset asthma just on 3 years ago. (A total of 3.5 months out of 6). During that period I gained 28 (repeat 28) lbs which are still stibbornly with me.  My exercise patterns are terrible – I am frightened at times even to walk the block in case I get an attack.  Anyone else with weight problems???  I would like to hear what others do about weight management (I am 55). Trevor

The short answer is Diet & Exercise. As we get older metabolism goes down, and if diet is not adjusted or exercise increased, or both,there is a tendency for weight to go up. If you are frightened to walk a block without an attack, sounds like your asthma is not adequately controlled. Don’t you carry your rescue inhaler, like Ventolin, with you when you go out? What meds are you taking & what dose? what are your symptoms? Are you seeing an asthma doctor and what was your diagnosis? Part of an asthma management plan is regular use of a Peak Flow Meter at home to monitor lung function, and an Action Plan to adjust meds to stay in green zone (80% of Personal Best). When your asthma is properly controlled, you should be able to live a relatively normal life. A book that explains this is ‘The Asthma Sourcebook’, Francis Adams, MD Have you read the FAQ for alt.support.asthma at http://www.radix.net/~mwg/asthma-gen.html Here’s a link to the Expert Panel Report 2 on Asthma Self-Management: http://www.ama-assn.org/special/asthma/treatmnt/guide/guidelin/comp4/… Excerpt: "The Expert Panel recommends that clinicians teach patients and families the essential information, medication skills, self-monitoring  techniques, and environmental control measures outlined in figure 4

Question:

   I have recently been diagnosed as being NIDDM so I am just getting    used to a new way of eating etc.  For an unconnected ailment my    doctor has just prescribed some anti-biotic capsules.  Since    starting to take the medication I have noticed that my urine    glucose levels have almost completely disappeared.  Is this a    coincidence, or do anti-biotics have some effect on sugar levels? First, If you are still spilling glucose in your urine,  I’d suggest a new doctor… This is not what I’d call great.  Endocrinologists treat diabetes in addition to a number of other conditions. Second, Yes, any infection will whack your Glucose levels,  Normally we talk about Blood Glucose here however, Not urine glucose as we try very hard not the spill any glucose (And we sometimes fail)  It looks like in your case they were Whacked INTO line, instead of out of line.  I would guess the anti-biotics may affect it too,  But the need for them is a real kicker in the glucose levels. Now, as to what to do 1: Get over the infection 2: Call local hospitals and inquire about diabetes self-management classes 3: Take one of #2,  Good classes are well worth their cost. "Nothing adds excitement like something that is none of your business" Attention Spammers: Fee for returning your SPAM to your postmaster $250.00 Texas 7 Course Meal: Bowl of chili & a 6-pack! Net-Tamer V 1.10  - Registered

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Just replying to your remark – yes, it is.  What methods do you have?   Best wishes,  Marianne. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -What the hell are you doing with urine testing?  Is the health system in the UK that backward?

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I lived in England for 7.5 years (see my .sig) and I couldn’t convince a doctor I wanted to do occasional urine testing and thereby write a prescription for them.  (Diabetics get free prescriptions of all types in the UK.)  It would have been nice last year when I went into DKA during a bad asthma/lung infection.  Kept telling them my Bg’s were way out of control, especially after starting Prednisalone (Prednisone to my American counterparts) to reduce the lung inflammation.  I even asked a consultant afterwards and all he said was "you test your blood don’t you?  you don’t need urine testing, then."   Now that I’m back in the US, I traded in my glucometer for an Accuchek <something with the electronic strips.  All my old Glucostix I’ve been using lately to keep tabs on what’s happening between meals.  At first I was a bit out of control, what with trying out some of the "forbidden fruits" I’d missed for all those years (albeit intermittently, not consistently), and so the strips started turning dark green.  These days, with a new insulin regime (NPH/R) no trace of green.  Yeah, that only tells me I’m not spilling sugar into my urine, nothing about ketones.  Coupled with regular blood testing several times a day, I know exactly where I’m at.  I know that I’m in control all around, not just before meals.  I have had to re-adjust what my meals consist of in order not to spike between meals enough that I’ve hit my threshold for the kidneys to start kicking in. Of course, when these strips run out, I’m not sure what I’ll be doing.  :-( Being in this newsgroup has certainly reinforced my control.  Thank you all for being here!  :-) Peg — I’m an American.  I used to live in England.  Now I’m back! – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Just replying to your remark – yes, it is.  What methods do you have?   Best wishes,  Marianne. What the hell are you doing with urine testing?  Is the health system in the UK that backward?

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Hi John and Charly and all you out there re urine testing type2s and UK – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I have recently been diagnosed as being NIDDM so I am just getting used to a new way of eating etc.  For an unconnected ailment my doctor has just prescribed some anti-biotic capsules.  Since starting to take the medication I have noticed that my urine glucose levels have almost completely disappeared.  Is this a coincidence, or do anti-biotics have some effect on sugar levels?  Caqn some one help? Indirectly.  The infection that they are clearing up is likely increasing your insulin resistance.  As the infection goes away, the insulin resistance comes down and your blood glucose levels follow. What the hell are you doing with urine testing?  Is the health system in the UK that backward?

Yes it is in a way. If you are Type2 and are just maintained on diet and exercise you don’t get any help with blood glucose monitors or strips. Also the support is quite low key until you get problems. John    I am type2 diet and excercise maintained. I bought a blood glucose monitor via ad in British Diabetics Assoc. magazine Balance, from them or from a newsagent. I got some test strips from maker and repeat supplies by prescription from my GP who with the practice nurse has done all my medical support apart from that I’ve done myself. I told him I wanted to stay fit as long as possible and he was pleased. I went for blood testing because you know how you’re doing and when things are climbing to-wards spill over levels, when the sugar is in the urine your blood gulouse level is already too high under modern approaches. I find a figure is better feedback than a no-sugar in urine result. Stick with this group too you’ll learn a lot, thanks to you all. I’ll be back when my computer returns with improved memory and repairs. Please bear with me I’m dyslexic too, sorry. — Thelma

Response:

I have recently been diagnosed as being NIDDM so I am just getting used to a new way of eating etc.  For an unconnected ailment my doctor has just prescribed some anti-biotic capsules.  Since starting to take the medication I have noticed that my urine glucose levels have almost completely disappeared.  Is this a coincidence, or do anti-biotics have some effect on sugar levels?  Caqn some one help?

Indirectly.  The infection that they are clearing up is likely increasing your insulin resistance.  As the infection goes away, the insulin resistance comes down and your blood glucose levels follow. What the hell are you doing with urine testing?  Is the health system in the UK that backward? — Charly Coughran

Response:

I have recently been diagnosed as being NIDDM so I am just getting used to a new way of eating etc.  For an unconnected ailment my doctor has just prescribed some anti-biotic capsules.  Since starting to take the medication I have noticed that my urine glucose levels have almost completely disappeared.  Is this a coincidence, or do anti-biotics have some effect on sugar levels?  Caqn some one help? Many Thanks John McLoughlin http://www.misha.co.uk

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Question:

Hi! I have suffered from panic attacks since around 1990. I have gotten familiar with my way of interpreting most of my bodily symptoms – like short of breath, etc. – and thus have gotten considerably less attacks last year. Really, there’s only one symptom that I have that still bugs me. Here it is: If I’m travelling, or sitting in business meetings etc. and when I feel a bit to tensed, when I start out too many projects at once, etc. I can feel a tension in my chest. Mostly on my left side, on the side of the chest, not straight forward. This can appear as a 2-3 second pain, not severe but enough to make me really scared! I have felt this in periods of increased stress and anxiety. Today for instance, I was sitting in my office, feeling calm and relaxed, and suddenly I had a phone call regarding my ex wife’s various attempts to make life miserable for me… Then this pain came and in 10 seconds I was really wounded up. Then I took 0.25 mG Lorazepam (Temesta from Wyeth), a small dose, and I calmed down. Last week I had this twice. First time I went to an airport medical center. they took an ECG, listened to heart and lungs etc. and told me I was fine etc. Day after, when visting a big European capital, I had the same thing after a business lunch. Scared as hell, I went in my little rental car to the Emergency room and presented my story again. This doctor said he was going to do a thourough check on me, and he took the ECG which looked fine and some 25 difrerent blood test, including everything that has to do with the heart. He went though the list and each and every blood test was ideal! He coould not find anything wrong with me. I felt much better. Then he told me, that maybe something was wrong physically with my muscles on my chest. Mabe an inflammation or streched muscle? He tried to provoce pain by pressing on the ribs and muscles and – vcoila! – on certain spots I did feel pain. Not the same pain but in the same region. As anxiety surely induce muscle tension in the chest maybe this could be the answer. Whenever I get these chest pains, I still feel fine – if it was a cardiac problem I would feel weak, dizzy, and all those other heart attack symptoms, wouldn’t I…? Still, there’s a grain of doubt and worry inside me, so please, if you have any ideas or have felt the same, please e-mail or post it rather – I suspect that many has experienced this problem. Best regards JOHN

Response:

hi.. i’ve just begun lurking here and i’m astonished at reading about the same symptoms i’ve been so scared about… was diagnosed as clinically depressed last year.. prozac and zoloft didnt’ work new doc… first appt. last wed…. thinks panic/anxiety is a better diagnosis… the chest pains wake me at night and radiate down my arm.. i have low bp, low cholesterol… no chest pains when i exercise… stiff neck most of the time… hyperventilate, grind my teeth, really lose it sometimes is there a FAQ for this newsgroup? would appreciate knowing more… doc wants me to try paxil… afraid of more meds, but maybe it’s the right one this time.. thanks

Welcome to asap, Suzanne. FAQ on its way — Gary Cooper

Response:

I get the EXACT same pains!  I can’t tell you how many times I’ve been to the doctor regarding this.  I’ve had all kinds of heart tests, and they’ve alway come back good, but the pain doesn’t go away.  At one time they thought I had MVP, but the test for that came back negative.  I’m a smoker (I know, I know), and sometimes that makes it worse.  I really do think mine are skeletal, but when they hit, I freak out!   Michelle

Response:

hi.. i’ve just begun lurking here and i’m astonished at reading about the same symptoms i’ve been so scared about… was diagnosed as clinically depressed last year.. prozac and zoloft didnt’ work new doc… first appt. last wed…. thinks panic/anxiety is a better diagnosis… the chest pains wake me at night and radiate down my arm.. i have low bp, low cholesterol… no chest pains when i exercise… stiff neck most of the time… hyperventilate, grind my teeth, really lose it sometimes is there a FAQ for this newsgroup? would appreciate knowing more… doc wants me to try paxil… afraid of more meds, but maybe it’s the right one this time.. thanks susanne (the one in the header is to discourage junk mail)

Response:

If I’m travelling, or sitting in business meetings etc. and when I feel a bit to tensed, when I start out too many projects at once, etc. I can feel a tension in my chest. Mostly on my left side, on the side of the chest, not straight forward. This can appear as a 2-3 second pain, not severe but enough to make me really scared!

This happens to "normal" people too. I get these frequently. My cardiologist/internist told me it was a muscle spasm. The stabbing makes it difficult to catch my breath as any chest movement intensifies the pain. My problem is poor posture in addition to being "up-tight." It’s scary, but it does go away. I pop an advil when it happens to avoid any recurrences and it has worked for me. I felt much better. Then he told me, that maybe something was wrong physically with my muscles on my chest. Mabe an inflammation or streched muscle? He tried to provoce pain by pressing on the ribs and muscles and – vcoila! – on certain spots I did feel pain. Not the same pain but in the same region. As anxiety surely induce muscle tension in the chest

maybe this could be the answer. I would suggest you join a stretching class, along the lines of Calinetics, or get the workbook, available at most majot book stores. Thstype of stretching done a couple of times a week will strengthen weak internal muscles and relax the ones that are all tensed up. My spasms have decreased since I took up stretching and learned to watch my posture.  Whenever I get these chest pains, I still feel fine – if it was a cardiac problem I would feel weak, dizzy, and all those other heart attack symptoms, wouldn’t I…?

Men almost *always* have major heart attack symptom – pain in arm, neck, chin, clammy feeling, dizziness, nausea.  (Women tend to have "silent" heart attacks after menopause.) And your EKG and blood work are fine, right? Then you are ok. If you were in line for a heart attack, it would have shown up in your tests.  To make you feel better though, watch your iron intake (or better yet, donate blood 6 times a year – blood donors *significantly* lower their risk of heart disease/attacks), and take a baby aspirin everyday.   Still, there’s a grain of doubt and worry inside me, so please, if you have any ideas or have felt the same, please e-mail or post it rather – I suspect that many has experienced this problem.

You are not alone! – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Best regards JOHN

Response:

Hi.  I just joined the group a few days ago, and sent this reply to John via e-mail.  Decided to go ahead and post it since it outlines my own experiences with PA.  I’d love to hear from anyone else with problems such as John and I have had. Not feeling too bad today – except for a bad tension headache in the lower left side of my skull.  My neck and back still hurt quite a bit. My left arm aches and there is some pain in my left chest that’s tender to the touch just above the breast.  But I ain’t panicking!  :) Have a good day everyone! Barbara Stoner John: I have been having these attacks episodically since about 1990 as well.  The first time was about 5 years ago, when I spent almost every other day on the phone to my doctor in tears for about two months in the winter.  One excursion to the ER cost me $500 – and my tests also come out fine!  At that time, I was heavily into caffeine – had been for years.  I finally diagnosed myself – I mean, take a couple of No-Doz tablets (coffee never agreed with me) and an hour later, start feeling sick.  Duhhh…..  The stuff finally caught up with me.  I quit, and I was fine for about 3 years.  Then in the spring of ‘95 it returned.  I felt so sick, I had a friend take me right to the doctor. These were the same people who had seen me three years before and had decided that it was panic attacks.  Not one of them ever considered the caffeine factor, even though I had told them that I took No Doz daily.   The doctor refused to see me and sent me away with a prescription for Xanax.  I took the Xanax and calmed down (the panic symptoms and fear went away) but the pain remained.  Someone suggested a chiropractor.  I started going, and the symptoms disappeared for another year.  About 3 weeks ago, they returned.  I’ve been to the emergency room twice since then.  The second time was when I woke up with a stabbing pain in my left chest area – and then all the other symptoms kicked in. Mine starts with chest pain – on the left side, shortness of breath, tingling down my left arm, slight nausea, dizziness – ALL the heart attack symptoms.  My ECG’s come out clean.  My blood pressure is on the low side.  My cholesterol count is low.  There is no heart disease in my family.  Still and all, you know how I feel – it’s hard to convince yourself that this time it isn’t IT!  I’m 53 years old.  I’ve been a smoker for about 30 years.  Thinking seriously about quitting now.  When the attacks start, a cigarette definitely makes it worse! But, here’s what I think is happening.  There is a cocked bone in my neck from an old injury.  When this gets knocked off balance somehow, the muscles on the left side of my body knot up and go into spasm.  My medical doctor (a different one now) has felt them in this condition – the muscles are all tight and knotted.  This constricts blood flow on my left side – and probably compresses a nerve or two – causing all of the above symptoms.  Any underlying stress adds to the tension.  When the symptoms start appearing, a panic reaction also sets in, so the thing becomes circular for awhile.  I do NOT get the racing heart associated with panic attacks, and I have no fear of leaving the house.  I do have a fear of another attack, which adds stress and tension. Right now I am wearing a cervical collar to try to keep the latest adjustment in place.  There is still some pain in my neck, shoulder, chest and arm, and I still feel pretty tentative.  But friends help. Distraction helps.  When friends are over and we are telling old stories and laughing, the pain and tension almost disappear completely.  When they leave, a little of it creeps back – you just can’t help thinking, "God!  Hope it doesn’t happen again!" and you just tense up a little.  Started to quit smoking when I went to the emergency room last (since smoking constricts the blood vessels, it makes it worse since the blood vessels are already being constricted by the muscle spasm) but decided that that extra stress was not what I needed right now, so I’ve cut down considerably and plan to go on the patch when this latest bout is under control.  When I call the aid car, the oxygen helps considerably!  This tells me that something has been restricting blood flow and little oxygen is getting through. If your heart checks out completely, I would seriously consider checking out the muscular/skeletal situation.  The times when you tend to get the symptoms seem to be times of stress for you.  I’ve been trying to get to the bottom of this whole thing for a few years now, and I’m convinced that, in my case anyway, there is an underlying physical cause that’s then made worse by the panic attack syndrome. Last year, while I was not having symptoms, I went through some extremely stressful periods – and the stress alone did not bring on a panic attack.  Something goes askew in my neck and my muscles, and then the slide begins. Good luck! Barbara Stoner – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi! I have suffered from panic attacks since around 1990. I have gotten familiar with my way of interpreting most of my bodily symptoms – like short of breath, etc. – and thus have gotten considerably less attacks last year. Really, there’s only one symptom that I have that still bugs me. Here it is: If I’m travelling, or sitting in business meetings etc. and when I feel a bit to tensed, when I start out too many projects at once, etc. I can feel a tension in my chest. Mostly on my left side, on the side of the chest, not straight forward. This can appear as a 2-3 second pain, not severe but enough to make me really scared! I have felt this in periods of increased stress and anxiety. Today for instance, I was sitting in my office, feeling calm and relaxed, and suddenly I had a phone call regarding my ex wife’s various attempts to make life miserable for me… Then this pain came and in 10 seconds I was really wounded up. Then I took 0.25 mG Lorazepam (Temesta from Wyeth), a small dose, and I calmed down. Last week I had this twice. First time I went to an airport medical center. they took an ECG, listened to heart and lungs etc. and told me I was fine etc. Day after, when visting a big European capital, I had the same thing after a business lunch. Scared as hell, I went in my little rental car to the Emergency room and presented my story again. This doctor said he was going to do a thourough check on me, and he took the ECG which looked fine and some 25 difrerent blood test, including everything that has to do with the heart. He went though the list and each and every blood test was ideal! He coould not find anything wrong with me. I felt much better. Then he told me, that maybe something was wrong physically with my muscles on my chest. Mabe an inflammation or streched muscle? He tried to provoce pain by pressing on the ribs and muscles and – vcoila! – on certain spots I did feel pain. Not the same pain but in the same region. As anxiety surely induce muscle tension in the chest maybe this could be the answer. Whenever I get these chest pains, I still feel fine – if it was a cardiac problem I would feel weak, dizzy, and all those other heart attack symptoms, wouldn’t I…? Still, there’s a grain of doubt and worry inside me, so please, if you have any ideas or have felt the same, please e-mail or post it rather – I suspect that many has experienced this problem. Best regards JOHN

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As anxiety surely induce muscle tension in the chest maybe this could be the answer. Whenever I get these chest pains, I still feel fine – if it was a cardiac problem I would feel weak, dizzy, and all those other heart attack symptoms, wouldn’t I…? Still, there’s a grain of doubt and worry inside me, so please, if you have any ideas or have felt the same, please e-mail or post it rather – I suspect that many has experienced this problem. Best regards JOHN

John, I’ve had PA for about 5 years now and experience the exact same symptoms as you.  I’ve had about 5 ekg’s, 2 stress tests, assorted blood work, etc. and all are fine – I’m only 23.  But I still feel like I’m going to have a heart attack every now and then.  It’s usually one small chest pain or double beat or something and I get this rush of adrenalin and overwhelming sense of fear – sometimes nothing is going on – but I can definately bring on a panic attack by freaking out over these pains.  As with you, I do feel real pain and can press on spots and feel real pain – my pa’s actually started with an intense bout of hyperventilation where I thought I had a heart attack and I probably stretched some muscles in my chest which have bothered me since then.  I’m currently on Prozac (20mg) and Klonopin (.25mg when I need it – rarely now).  The prozac has helped remove the chronic fear of having a heart attack as no rational thought ever helped me.  I’ve also found that doing Deep muscle relaxation and breathing exercies which I found in a book that I highly recommend called "The Panic and Anxiety Workbook" by Dr. Borne.  They have helped relieve some of the tension in my chest and the breathing helps me keep calm or calm down instead of taking tranquilizers. I wish you the best and I hope this helps! -Chad. Faculty Liaison MIT, Academic Computing http://arizona.mit.edu

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John, I think that tension in the chest muscles are a source of pain to a lot of PA’s. Also a condition called costrocondritis (SP), which is basically athritis of the ribs and connective tiissues causes pain like a heart attack. I know this, and even though I know this, I still get extremely panicky when it occurs. I just have to tell myself to calm down, that I’ve had all the tests, I’m not having a heart attack, and sometimes by the time I am through telling myself all that, the pain in gone. But that still leaves me on edge for some time, thinking that I am feeling the pain still, listening to my heart, taking my pulse etc. I think there are probably plenty of us on this line that have had the same problems so don’t feel alone. We are with you, and know what you are going through. Hope this helps some. Jody

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I know what you are talking about.  Has your doctor mentioned Mitral Valve Prolapse to you? Just a thought. Thank you for your advice, Peace, Don – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -I have been experiencing the same thing with my heart.  I was rushed t o the doctor last week because my resting pulse was 170.  I am currently wearing an event monitor.  When I experience symptoms, I push a button ond it records my EKG, the I later transmit it to the office.My doctor thinks mine is related to my slo-bid.  You need to see your doctor and gert it checked out though.  It could be a seroius problem. Patricia

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Re: Heart Racing. Hi Don. I’ve been asthmatic for my whole life, but only ran into the heart racing problem in the last few years.  Basically, I found that excessive Ventolin (more than 4 puffs per day) and/or slo-bid will cause heart racing and the sensation that my heart is beating too hard (I can count my beats just by *feeling* my heart pounding on my chest).  After I stopped slo-bid and reduced my Ventolin intake through use of steroid and non-steroid anti-inflamitories (Beclovent and Tilade), perception of the heart racing and pounding conditions disappeared.  BTW: My resting pulse is usually between 50 and 60. When I was having troubles, I had a resting pulse of up to 120 and little things like walking up a flight of stairs would make my pulse shoot up to 140 or more.  In the mornings, when I woke up, my heart would always be pounding and my pulse would be elevated … just as you described. I hope that helps.  If you have any questions, feel free to send me mail. -Scott                                           Cog Works Studios  <http://stripe.colorado.edu/~berkebil/         <http://www.cogworks.com/ "My main reason for adopting literature as a profession was that, as  the author is never seen by his clients, he need not dress respectably." –George Bernard Shaw

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – For years now, I often wake up with my heart racing, and me feeling out of breath.  I’m talking like 100 beats a minute or more.  I’ve checked my pulse when I go to sleep, and it is usually between 60 – 80. Does anyone else here no what I’m talking about? Also, I notice that my "peak flow" is hardest to reach in the mornings.  For example, when I wake up I sometimes can barely get to 450, but later in the day it will go as high as 530-540. ANY advice or comments are *again* appreciated. Thanks so much! Peace, Don I have been experiencing the same thing with my heart.  I was rushed to the doctor last week because my resting pulse was 170.  I am currently wearing an event monitor.  When I experience symptoms, I push a button ond it records my EKG, the I later transmit it to the office.My doctor thinks mine is related to my slo-bid.  You need to see your doctor and gert it checked out though.  It could be a seroius problem. Patricia

If you are taking a theophilline based product or using Proventil or Maxaire inhalers at bedtime or if you wake up at night, it can have this effect! Mary —          || __/ ||           |   / _____/        `–_                               | Wally Karraker                |    Mary Karraker 2 The Macs Computer Services  |    Thundapurr Cattery Web site: http://www.pld.com/users/2themacs/master.html

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – For years now, I often wake up with my heart racing, and me feeling out of breath.  I’m talking like 100 beats a minute or more.  I’ve checked my pulse when I go to sleep, and it is usually between 60 – 80. Does anyone else here no what I’m talking about? Also, I notice that my "peak flow" is hardest to reach in the mornings.  For example, when I wake up I sometimes can barely get to 450, but later in the day it will go as high as 530-540. ANY advice or comments are *again* appreciated. Thanks so much! Peace, Don

You’re almost certainly allergic to dust mites, vacuum the bed regularly, it really helps. Don’t worry about the accelerated heart beats, are you taking extra medication before you go to bed? Salbutamol can raise the heart rate (volmax & stuff) Lee. To get random signatures put text files into a folder called