Question:
"gs" <gs1276_nos…@charter.net
wrote in message
news:uh43j3rsc8oa9f@corp.supernews.com… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> "Marilee" <mae…@polarcomm.com
wrote in message
> news:aesll2$9op16$1@ID-76373.news.dfncis.de… > > "gs" <gs1276_nos…@charter.net
wrote in message
> > news:uh2srjl0elsi7d@corp.supernews.com… > > > "Mink" <Bas…@televar.com
wrote in message
> > > news:3D116764.32D3180A@televar.com… > > > > > > >snipped<<<<<< > > Is it proper to ask my dr. if I could talk about this without > > the > > > > conversation being written in my medical file? > > > Yes, you can ask your doctor. Explain your concerns regarding the
possible cancellation of your health insurance. But purposely hiding information *can* be considered fraud. I explained that my situation was different. No where on any
doctor’s form
or insurance form that I’ve seen, does it ask about sexual abuse.
Sorry, Gwen. I wasn’t addressing -your- situation. I apologize for the confusion. I was merely making a statement regarding insurance applications–of any kind. Marilee – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -
I do answer questions regarding depression. When the doctor asks
about the
diagnosis, I give appropriate answers, I don’t lie or leave things
out. The
sexual abuse is only part of the picture and is left out due to
respecting
my privacy. It is noted that I grew up in an extreme dysfunctional
alcoholic
family. I am luckier than most since my major health concerns manifested
long after
the abuse and after it was dealt with. Gwen Marilee Has anyone ever had such request, and what was the outcome? My doctor did this regarding childhood sexual abuse. I realize
it
isn’t the same thing, but it was done so the insurance company wouldn’t
have
the information. Gwen Kate
Response:
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Mink wrote:
I have a doctor appt. Friday to have a mole removed, and to discuss some medications I am taking. I am having a slight problem with depression, although I am feeling 99% better now. The problem is that if I discuss depression with my doctor, I am afraid she will document this in my medical file, and if my new insurance company finds out anything about depression (although I have never had a problem with this until Feb., and have never taken anti-depressants – and I don’t want to be prescribed any) they could very well cancel my coverage. Please keep in mind that I am on an individual health insurance plan, and they seldom covers services for depression let alone meds. It certainly is not like the group plans I used to be on. Is it proper to ask my dr. if I could talk about this without the conversation being written in my medical file? Has anyone ever had such request, and what was the outcome? Kate
You don’t mention what state you’re in (I assume you’re in the USA if your coverage is so bad) but if you go to google.com and put in your state name and ‘department of insurance’ or ’state insurance office’ you’ll probably get to their webpage – then go to ‘consumer affairs’ or whatever is similar. In Illinois it’s http://www.state.il.us/ins/default.htm If you have trouble finding it for your state, give a shout out and we’ll help you look. Best of luck to you, Chakolate — It is never too late to be what you might have been. George Eliot
Response:
"gs" <gs1276_nos…@charter.net
wrote in message
news:uh2srjl0elsi7d@corp.supernews.com… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> "Mink" <Bas…@televar.com
wrote in message
> news:3D116764.32D3180A@televar.com… > > I have a doctor appt. Friday to have a mole removed, and to discuss some
medications I am taking. I am having a slight problem with depression, although I am
feeling 99%
better now. The problem is that if I discuss depression with my doctor, I am
afraid
she will document this in my medical file, and if my new
insurance
company finds out anything about depression (although I have
never had a
problem with this until Feb., and have never taken
anti-depressants -
and I don’t want to be prescribed any) they could very well
cancel my
coverage. Please keep in mind that I am on an individual health insurance plan, and they seldom covers services for depression
let alone
meds. It certainly is not like the group plans I used to be on. Why would they cancel your insurance because you are depressed?
Does your
insurance list depression as a reason for cancellation? Depression
can be a
symptom of an underlying health problem. Anti depressants are prescribed as treatment for many conditions,
not just
depression. Any doctor can prescribe anti depressants. Many people with coverage go outside their insurance to recieve
mental
health treatment. Many people with health insurance don’t have
mental health
coverage (ex. therapy isn’t covered). Many insurance companies
that don’t
have mental health coverage, cover anti depressants. Check into your state’s laws regarding insurance. Checking federal
laws
wouldn’t be a bad idea either. Is it proper to ask my dr. if I could talk about this without
the
conversation being written in my medical file? Yes, you can ask your doctor. Explain your concerns regarding the
possible
cancellation of your health insurance.
But purposely hiding information *can* be considered fraud. Marilee – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -
Has anyone ever had such request, and what was the outcome? My doctor did this regarding childhood sexual abuse. I realize it
isn’t the
same thing, but it was done so the insurance company wouldn’t have
the
information. Gwen Kate
Response:
Mink wrote:
I start this new insurance plan eff. July 1, and I had to answer a question as to whether or not I have been diagnosed with depression during the past ten years. When I sent the app. in five weeks ago, the answer was no. But, I want to get one more appt. in before I start on my new plan, and if the dr. puts "depression" in my file, well, then I basically lied on the app., even though it happened after I sent in the form.
Well, no. As far as I know, the "pre-existing condition" barriers in some insurance policies don’t apply to conditions which were not yet diagnosed when you purchased the coverage. But do check the details of your particular policy before you get too worried. –Pat Kight kig…@peak.org
Response:
Pat Kight <kig…@peak.org
wrote in message
news:3D11E3D6.FF865DAA@peak.org… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -
Mink wrote: I start this new insurance plan eff. July 1, and I had to answer a
question as to
whether or not I have been diagnosed with depression during the past ten
years.
When I sent the app. in five weeks ago, the answer was no. But, I want
to get one
more appt. in before I start on my new plan, and if the dr. puts
"depression" in
my file, well, then I basically lied on the app., even though it
happened after I
sent in the form. Well, no. As far as I know, the "pre-existing condition" barriers in some insurance policies don’t apply to conditions which were not yet diagnosed when you purchased the coverage. But do check the details of your particular policy before you get too worried.
Slight correction: There are plenty of instances where "pre-existing" matters, even if a doctor hasn’t "diagnosed" the condition. For instance, if a couple goes in to take out an insurance policy, answers "no" to all the questions, then finds out 3 days after the policy takes effect that the woman is pregnant, and was pregnant *before* the policy’s inception date, it was a pre-exisiting condition. The policy can be rescinded by the insurance company, and all premium paid refunded. No fraud, because the questions were answered truthfully, but no coverage, because the condition was truly "pre-existing". There are lots of questions an agent/company asks that have to do with "Have you been diagnosed with, or experienced symptoms of……" on an application. Marilee – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -
–Pat Kight kig…@peak.org
Response:
On Thu, 20 Jun 2002 21:12:33 GMT, Mink <Bas…@televar.com
wrote: And, I don’t want to be put on anti-depressants nor any other medicine that will trigger depression.
Nobody can put you on anything. You can refuse anti-depressants up front and enquire about the depressive tendencies of any other drug proposed. If you are assured that drug X is innocent in this regard, you *still* don’t have to take it – or even fill the prescription – until you have checked it out on the web. Putting the drug name into a google search engine should bring up links both to official sites *and* anecdotal discussions about it. One drug to be wary of is any variety of progestogen, particular MPA (provera/prempro/cycrin/premphase) Best wishes, Tishy
Response:
"Linda Scheimann" <uscho…@yahoo.com
wrote in message
news:aet17h$9ns2t$1@ID-131262.news.dfncis.de… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -
I would not tell your doctor at this visit. For his own protection he has
to
document what he hears. He’s liable for what he knows whether he writes it down or not. I would not check the insurance coverage by asking the agent. The agent
has
no relationship of legal confidentiality and there’s no guarantee he will not pass the information on to the company. He does much more business
with
the company than he can hope to do with you. I would consider taking the depression issue to a local mental health
clinic
and simply paying the bill and keeping my own counsel. But if you want doctor patient confidentiality, I would see a psychiatrist, not a psychologist. That costs more money, but it buys legal confidentiality.
I have doctor patient confidentiality with my psychologist. I have to sign a release before any information is shared with anyone. Gwen – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -
If you have a religious affiliation, I would consider talking to a clergyman. They do have legal confidentiality and they won’t be asked for medical information by anyone else. Also, they are less likely to charge,
if > at all. You only need a doctor if you need or want a prescription, not for > talk therapy alone. It’s possible to find a clergyman with counseling > training and certification. It does not have to be from your own church. > Best wishes, > Linda > (not a lawyer, but some law credits, and more to the point, some time in > therapy, married to Richard, clergyman) > Mink <Bas…@televar.com
wrote in message
> news:3D117BD6.BA27CEAE@televar.com… > > Thanks Gwen. Like you said, I basically don’t want my ins. co. to get > ahold of > > this info. > > If you type this on a search engine you will see where I am coming from -
I think. LOL Type" Prozac may be hazardous to your health insurance". I found it to
be > a > > real eye opener as it relates to individual health insurance. > > Sorry, but I am not too computer savvy, and am not sure how to post the > url. > > Thanks. > > Kate > > gs wrote: > > > "Mink" <Bas…@televar.com
wrote in message
> > > news:3D116764.32D3180A@televar.com… > > > > I have a doctor appt. Friday to have a mole removed, and to discuss > some > > > > medications I am taking. > > > > I am having a slight problem with depression, although I am feeling > 99% > > > > better now. > > > > The problem is that if I discuss depression with my doctor, I am > afraid > > > > she will document this in my medical file, and if my new insurance > > > > company finds out anything about depression (although I have never had
a problem with this until Feb., and have never taken
anti-depressants -
and I don’t want to be prescribed any) they could very well cancel
my
coverage. Please keep in mind that I am on an individual health insurance plan, and they seldom covers services for depression let alone meds. It certainly is not like the group plans I used to be on. Why would they cancel your insurance because you are depressed? Does your insurance list depression as a reason for cancellation? Depression can be a symptom of an underlying health problem. Anti depressants are prescribed as treatment for many conditions, not just depression. Any doctor can prescribe anti depressants. Many people with coverage go outside their insurance to recieve
mental
health treatment. Many people with health insurance don’t have mental health coverage (ex. therapy isn’t covered). Many insurance companies that don’t have mental health coverage, cover anti depressants. Check into your state’s laws regarding insurance. Checking federal
laws
wouldn’t be a bad idea either. Is it proper to ask my dr. if I could talk about this without the conversation being written in my medical file? Yes, you can ask your doctor. Explain your concerns regarding the possible cancellation of your health insurance. Has anyone ever had such request, and what was the outcome? My doctor did this regarding childhood sexual abuse. I realize it
isn’t
the same thing, but it was done so the insurance company wouldn’t have the information. Gwen Kate
Response:
I am not trying to be dishonest about this, but I don’t want it blown out of proportion when I see the doctor. I don’t even want to get into a big discussion about it, but now that I am 99% better, I feel I can talk about it to her. And, I don’t want to be put on anti-depressants nor any other medicine that will trigger depression. Ack, why is life so difficult. LOL Kate – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Ruth J wrote:
Yes yes yes yes I have **exactly** the same problem!! Fortunately, I have known my doctor for ten years and he is very much willing to "not document" things. I believe you have the right under doctor-patient privilege to make this request, although I do not know the law. If your doctor will not do this, you might try (if you can afford it and want meds of a kind not covered) the tactic I used: go to another doctor, have the Rx filled at a different drugstore, don’t give them your SSN, and pay for it out of pocket. My regular doctor knows about this now, after the fact. best wishes and let us know how this turns our. RuthJ. (posted & mailed) Mink wrote: I have a doctor appt. Friday to have a mole removed, and to discuss some medications I am taking. I am having a slight problem with depression, although I am feeling 99% better now. The problem is that if I discuss depression with my doctor, I am afraid she will document this in my medical file, and if my new insurance company finds out anything about depression (although I have never had a problem with this until Feb., and have never taken anti-depressants – and I don’t want to be prescribed any) they could very well cancel my coverage. Please keep in mind that I am on an individual health insurance plan, and they seldom covers services for depression let alone meds. It certainly is not like the group plans I used to be on. Is it proper to ask my dr. if I could talk about this without the conversation being written in my medical file? Has anyone ever had such request, and what was the outcome? Kate
Response:
You could tell her you have been depressed at some time in the past, and not specify recently, or when. This would cover the interaction question – whether a new medication could trigger a recurrence – without contradicting your negative answer to the insurance question. Just a thought. Linda Mink <Bas…@televar.com
wrote in message
news:3D1245F8.4F755032@televar.com… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -
Linda, All good info. and I thank you. My main concern is that I am seeing my
Dr. for
a switch in medication. If a new medication triggers depression, than I
don’t
want it. I almost feel like I have to bring this into the discussion. A no win situation. Thanks. Kate Linda Scheimann wrote: I would not tell your doctor at this visit. For his own protection he
has to
document what he hears. He’s liable for what he knows whether he writes
it
down or not. I would not check the insurance coverage by asking the agent. The agent
has
no relationship of legal confidentiality and there’s no guarantee he
will
not pass the information on to the company. He does much more business
with
the company than he can hope to do with you. I would consider taking the depression issue to a local mental health
clinic
and simply paying the bill and keeping my own counsel. But if you want doctor patient confidentiality, I would see a psychiatrist, not a psychologist. That costs more money, but it buys legal confidentiality. If you have a religious affiliation, I would consider talking to a clergyman. They do have legal confidentiality and they won’t be asked
for
medical information by anyone else. Also, they are less likely to
charge, if
at all. You only need a doctor if you need or want a prescription, not
for > > talk therapy alone. It’s possible to find a clergyman with counseling > > training and certification. It does not have to be from your own church. > > Best wishes, > > Linda > > (not a lawyer, but some law credits, and more to the point, some time in > > therapy, married to Richard, clergyman) > > Mink <Bas…@televar.com
wrote in message
> > news:3D117BD6.BA27CEAE@televar.com… > > > Thanks Gwen. Like you said, I basically don’t want my ins. co. to get > > ahold of > > > this info. > > > If you type this on a search engine you will see where I am coming from -
I think. LOL Type" Prozac may be hazardous to your health insurance". I found it
to be
a real eye opener as it relates to individual health insurance. Sorry, but I am not too computer savvy, and am not sure how to post
the > > url. > > > Thanks. > > > Kate > > > gs wrote: > > > > "Mink" <Bas…@televar.com
wrote in message
> > > > news:3D116764.32D3180A@televar.com… > > > > > I have a doctor appt. Friday to have a mole removed, and to discuss
some medications I am taking. I am having a slight problem with depression, although I am
feeling
99% better now. The problem is that if I discuss depression with my doctor, I am afraid she will document this in my medical file, and if my new insurance company finds out anything about depression (although I have never
had
a problem with this until Feb., and have never taken
anti-depressants -
and I don’t want to be prescribed any) they could very well cancel
my
coverage. Please keep in mind that I am on an individual health insurance plan, and they seldom covers services for depression let alone meds. It certainly is not like the group plans I used to be on. Why would they cancel your insurance because you are depressed?
Does
your insurance list depression as a reason for cancellation? Depression
can
be a symptom of an underlying health problem. Anti depressants are prescribed as treatment for many conditions,
not
just depression. Any doctor can prescribe anti depressants. Many people with coverage go outside their insurance to recieve
mental
health treatment. Many people with health insurance don’t have
mental
health coverage (ex. therapy isn’t covered). Many insurance companies that don’t have mental health coverage, cover anti depressants. Check into your state’s laws regarding insurance. Checking federal
laws
wouldn’t be a bad idea either. Is it proper to ask my dr. if I could talk about this without the conversation being written in my medical file? Yes, you can ask your doctor. Explain your concerns regarding the possible cancellation of your health insurance. Has anyone ever had such request, and what was the outcome? My doctor did this regarding childhood sexual abuse. I realize it
isn’t
the same thing, but it was done so the insurance company wouldn’t have
the
information. Gwen Kate
Response:
Linda, All good info. and I thank you. My main concern is that I am seeing my Dr. for a switch in medication. If a new medication triggers depression, than I don’t want it. I almost feel like I have to bring this into the discussion. A no win situation. Thanks. Kate – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Linda Scheimann wrote:
I would not tell your doctor at this visit. For his own protection he has to document what he hears. He’s liable for what he knows whether he writes it down or not. I would not check the insurance coverage by asking the agent. The agent has no relationship of legal confidentiality and there’s no guarantee he will not pass the information on to the company. He does much more business with the company than he can hope to do with you. I would consider taking the depression issue to a local mental health clinic and simply paying the bill and keeping my own counsel. But if you want doctor patient confidentiality, I would see a psychiatrist, not a psychologist. That costs more money, but it buys legal confidentiality. If you have a religious affiliation, I would consider talking to a clergyman. They do have legal confidentiality and they won’t be asked for medical information by anyone else. Also, they are less likely to charge, if at all. You only need a doctor if you need or want a prescription, not for talk therapy alone. It’s possible to find a clergyman with counseling training and certification. It does not have to be from your own church. Best wishes, Linda (not a lawyer, but some law credits, and more to the point, some time in therapy, married to Richard, clergyman) Mink <Bas…@televar.com wrote in message news:3D117BD6.BA27CEAE@televar.com… Thanks Gwen. Like you said, I basically don’t want my ins. co. to get ahold of this info. If you type this on a search engine you will see where I am coming from – I think. LOL Type" Prozac may be hazardous to your health insurance". I found it to be a real eye opener as it relates to individual health insurance. Sorry, but I am not too computer savvy, and am not sure how to post the url. Thanks. Kate gs wrote: "Mink" <Bas…@televar.com wrote in message news:3D116764.32D3180A@televar.com… I have a doctor appt. Friday to have a mole removed, and to discuss some medications I am taking. I am having a slight problem with depression, although I am feeling 99% better now. The problem is that if I discuss depression with my doctor, I am afraid she will document this in my medical file, and if my new insurance company finds out anything about depression (although I have never had a problem with this until Feb., and have never taken anti-depressants – and I don’t want to be prescribed any) they could very well cancel my coverage. Please keep in mind that I am on an individual health insurance plan, and they seldom covers services for depression let alone meds. It certainly is not like the group plans I used to be on. Why would they cancel your insurance because you are depressed? Does your insurance list depression as a reason for cancellation? Depression can be a symptom of an underlying health problem. Anti depressants are prescribed as treatment for many conditions, not just depression. Any doctor can prescribe anti depressants. Many people with coverage go outside their insurance to recieve mental health treatment. Many people with health insurance don’t have mental health coverage (ex. therapy isn’t covered). Many insurance companies that don’t have mental health coverage, cover anti depressants. Check into your state’s laws regarding insurance. Checking federal laws wouldn’t be a bad idea either. Is it proper to ask my dr. if I could talk about this without the conversation being written in my medical file? Yes, you can ask your doctor. Explain your concerns regarding the possible cancellation of your health insurance. Has anyone ever had such request, and what was the outcome? My doctor did this regarding childhood sexual abuse. I realize it isn’t the same thing, but it was done so the insurance company wouldn’t have the information. Gwen Kate
Response:
Thanks a heap for the good info. I am going to discuss this with my doctor, although depression is not the main reason for seeing her. I just don’t want to be put on another medication if it is going to make the depression come back. I got rid of it, and want to keep it that way. :) Thanks. Kate – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Marilee wrote:
"Mink" <Bas…@televar.com wrote in message news:3D116764.32D3180A@televar.com… I have a doctor appt. Friday to have a mole removed, and to discuss some medications I am taking. I am having a slight problem with depression, although I am feeling 99% better now. The problem is that if I discuss depression with my doctor, I am afraid she will document this in my medical file, and if my new insurance company finds out anything about depression (although I have never had a problem with this until Feb., and have never taken anti-depressants – and I don’t want to be prescribed any) they could very well cancel my coverage. Please keep in mind that I am on an individual health insurance plan, and they seldom covers services for depression let alone meds. It certainly is not like the group plans I used to be on. Is it proper to ask my dr. if I could talk about this without the conversation being written in my medical file? Has anyone ever had such request, and what was the outcome? Kate I don’t know what state you live in, but I *do* know something about insurance applications. Your answer of "no" was not a lie. Your answer was truthful at the time the application was taken. The thing that is -likely- to happen is that the insurance company will put a waiver on your policy for treatment of depression. They’ll consider the depression a pre-existing condition, and tell you (and probably require you to sign something) that they won’t pay for anything that relates to the depression. Different companies have different things that make a person uninsurable; some are no-brainers, like cancer. Others aren’t "filed" to do waivers, and they must cancel. The state office to contact is not the Attorney General, but the Insurance Commissioner. (Sharon was not far off, but the Attorney General usually oversees other businesses.) A visit to your state government’s home page will likely give you phone numbers. If you need any help, e-mail me. BTW, I work in an insurance agency, and deal with this type of thing pretty often. Marilee
Response:
In article <aet45f$9tcv…@ID-76373.news.dfncis.de
, "Marilee"
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -<mae…@polarcomm.com
wrote: "Linda Scheimann" <uscho…@yahoo.com wrote in message news:aet17h$9ns2t$1@ID-131262.news.dfncis.de… I would not tell your doctor at this visit. For his own protection he has to document what he hears. He’s liable for what he knows whether he writes it down or not. I would not check the insurance coverage by asking the agent. The agent has no relationship of legal confidentiality and there’s no guarantee he will not pass the information on to the company. He does much more business with the company than he can hope to do with you. Does much more business with? He’s usually under contract *with* the company. An agent has legal obligations to the company(ies) whose products he sells, and, indeed, can lose his license to sell insurance if he participates in any fraud, because knowingly withholding information that may affect a policy issue *is* fraud. That having been said, many people pose "hypothetical" questions to their agents in cases such as these, and a good agent gives an honest answer. Since he has no way of knowing if the question is about the person or their first cousin who is also shopping for insurance, he need not report it to the company. Lots of people call our office to ask hypotheticals, even if we’re not their insurers. I would consider taking the depression issue to a local mental health clinic and simply paying the bill and keeping my own counsel. But if you want doctor patient confidentiality, I would see a psychiatrist, not a psychologist. That costs more money, but it buys legal confidentiality. If, however, the cover-up is discovered later, (and legal confidentiality has nothing to do with anything if, at some point in the future, you ask your health insurance company to pay bills for something you knowingly kept from them) it can cause trouble.
Is there not usually some kind of time limit on these questions? If ypu haven’t been seen by a doctor/treated for that particular problem for an extended period of time (7 years sticks out in my mind for some reason) it is no longer a "pre-existing condition?" After all in a sense all conditions are "pre-existing." IIRC Maryland insurers once tried to have breast cancer declared a "pre-existing condition" because it takes many years to become clinically significant but the "seeds" for the disease are "pre-existing." The State Supreme Court threw that out finally. I think one could say the same of many other health problems. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -
If, OTOH, you *never* ask your insurance company to pay said bills, then there’s no reason for them to request similar medical records. Marilee
Response:
Terri <vl-hb…@erols.com
wrote in message
news:vl-hb001-97DA1B.14513920062002@news.erols.com… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> In article <aet45f$9tcv…@ID-76373.news.dfncis.de>, "Marilee" > <mae…@polarcomm.com> wrote: > > "Linda Scheimann" <uscho…@yahoo.com
wrote in message
> > news:aet17h$9ns2t$1@ID-131262.news.dfncis.de… > > > I would not tell your doctor at this visit. For his own protection > > he has to > > > document what he hears. He’s liable for what he knows whether he > > writes it > > > down or not. > > > I would not check the insurance coverage by asking the agent. The > > agent has > > > no relationship of legal confidentiality and there’s no guarantee > > he will > > > not pass the information on to the company. He does much more > > business with > > > the company than he can hope to do with you. > > Does much more business with? He’s usually under contract *with* > > the company. An agent has legal obligations to the company(ies) > > whose products he sells, and, indeed, can lose his license to sell > > insurance if he participates in any fraud, because knowingly > > withholding information that may affect a policy issue *is* fraud. > > That having been said, many people pose "hypothetical" questions to > > their agents in cases such as these, and a good agent gives an > > honest answer. Since he has no way of knowing if the question is > > about the person or their first cousin who is also shopping for > > insurance, he need not report it to the company. > > Lots of people call our office to ask hypotheticals, even if we’re > > not their insurers. > > > I would consider taking the depression issue to a local mental > > health clinic > > > and simply paying the bill and keeping my own counsel. But if you > > want > > > doctor patient confidentiality, I would see a psychiatrist, not a > > > psychologist. That costs more money, but it buys legal > > confidentiality. > > If, however, the cover-up is discovered later, (and legal > > confidentiality has nothing to do with anything if, at some point in > > the future, you ask your health insurance company to pay bills for > > something you knowingly kept from them) it can cause trouble. > Is there not usually some kind of time limit on these questions? If ypu > haven’t been seen by a doctor/treated for that particular problem for an > extended period of time (7 years sticks out in my mind for some reason) > it is no longer a "pre-existing condition?" After all in a sense all > conditions are "pre-existing." IIRC Maryland insurers once tried to have > breast cancer declared a "pre-existing condition" because it takes many > years to become clinically significant but the "seeds" for the disease > are "pre-existing." The State Supreme Court threw that out finally. I > think one could say the same of many other health problems.
But that’s not *quite* what I was talking about when I used the pregnancy example. Most of the questions (on the application, which the agent has to actually read aloud one-by-one) have a year limit: (What follows are some sample questions from an application. Any typos are mine): Has any applicant: (underline applicable items) a. Sought medical advice, had a checkup, consultation, illness, injury, surgery, hospitalization, electro-cardiogram (EKG), e-ray, urinalysis or other diagnostic study *in the past 5 years*? b. Taken doctor prescribed medication *in the past 5 years*? c. Been advised or plan to receive treatment, follow-up care, diagnostic testing, hospitalization or surgery which has not been completed? [several skipped] h. Gained or lost more than 20 pounds *in the past year*? Has any applicant in the *past ten years* had any indication of or been seen for: (underline applicable items) a. Disorder of eyes, ears, nose or throat? b. Dizziness, fainting, headache, speech defect, paralysis, seizure, or stroke? c.Shortness of breath, persisten hoarseness or cough, blood spitting, bronchitis, allergies, asthma, emphysema or other respiratory disorder? [skipping down] f. Mental, nervous, emotional, or behavioral disorder; chemical imbalance, or eating disorders? etc. Some questions say "Have you *ever* been treated for….", while others say "past 5 years" or "past 10 years". As long as you’re truthful on the application, you’re not guilty of fraud. (And, let me say, that saying "yes" to some doesn’t mean you’ll be rejected or even have a waiver. It means you’re giving them the proper information, and if you went to a doctor last year for strep throat, had a full recovery, etc., there won’t be any problem/rejection/waiver. If, however, some doctor wrote in your file that you should have a tonsillectomy, then your throat problems will likely have a waiver.) (And if you answer "no" to everything, that’s a bad sign, too. They *want* you to have gone to the doctor at least once or twice. Someone who suddenly seeks health insurance and has *never* been to the doctor, even for a routine thing, is highly suspect.) Then there is the ‘contestability period’, which is one of those hotbeds of discussion when it comes to insurance ethics. This is not a secret, it’s easy to discover, but a lot of people are unaware of it, just the same: If a health insurance (or life insurance) policy is issued, whether you’re truthful on the policy or not (at least in our state), and you have a pre-existing condition that medical records didn’t reveal, (or if the insurance company failed to discover in your records, etc.) and you didn’t need to seek treatment for two full years (it might be 3 years in some states) from the date the policy was begun, the insurance company still has to pay your claims. Marilee – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -
If, OTOH, you *never* ask your insurance company to pay said bills, then there’s no reason for them to request similar medical records. Marilee
Response:
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -
In article <aet45f$9tcv…@ID-76373.news.dfncis.de, "Marilee" <mae…@polarcomm.com wrote: "Linda Scheimann" <uscho…@yahoo.com wrote in message news:aet17h$9ns2t$1@ID-131262.news.dfncis.de… I would not tell your doctor at this visit. For his own protection he has to document what he hears. He’s liable for what he knows whether he writes it down or not. I would not check the insurance coverage by asking the agent. The agent has no relationship of legal confidentiality and there’s no guarantee he will not pass the information on to the company. He does much more business with the company than he can hope to do with you. Does much more business with? He’s usually under contract *with* the company. An agent has legal obligations to the company(ies) whose products he sells, and, indeed, can lose his license to sell insurance if he participates in any fraud, because knowingly withholding information that may affect a policy issue *is* fraud.
In my case last summer, I dealt with an independent agent who generated business for several different health insurers. He was licensed to sell them all. Agency implies contract, of course. Linda – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -
That having been said, many people pose "hypothetical" questions to their agents in cases such as these, and a good agent gives an honest answer. Since he has no way of knowing if the question is about the person or their first cousin who is also shopping for insurance, he need not report it to the company. Lots of people call our office to ask hypotheticals, even if we’re not their insurers. I would consider taking the depression issue to a local mental health clinic and simply paying the bill and keeping my own counsel. But if you want doctor patient confidentiality, I would see a psychiatrist, not a psychologist. That costs more money, but it buys legal confidentiality. If, however, the cover-up is discovered later, (and legal confidentiality has nothing to do with anything if, at some point in the future, you ask your health insurance company to pay bills for something you knowingly kept from them) it can cause trouble. If, OTOH, you *never* ask your insurance company to pay said bills, then there’s no reason for them to request similar medical records. Marilee
Response:
Marilee wrote:
Pat Kight <kig…@peak.org wrote in message Well, no. As far as I know, the "pre-existing condition" barriers in some insurance policies don’t apply to conditions which were not yet diagnosed when you purchased the coverage. But do check the details of your particular policy before you get too worried. Slight correction: There are plenty of instances where "pre-existing" matters, even if a doctor hasn’t "diagnosed" the condition.
Ah. My own experience has been with conditions that may have existed before purchasing the policy, but weren’t diagnosed until much later (glaucoma, for instance). This hasn’t been a problem for me, but that may be due to the kind of insurance involved (large group policy versus individual policy, for instance) and the particulars of the policy.
For instance, if a couple goes in to take out an insurance policy, answers "no" to all the questions, then finds out 3 days after the policy takes effect that the woman is pregnant, and was pregnant *before* the policy’s inception date, it was a pre-exisiting condition. The policy can be rescinded by the insurance company, and all premium paid refunded. No fraud, because the questions were answered truthfully, but no coverage, because the condition was truly "pre-existing".
Sure, that makes sense.
There are lots of questions an agent/company asks that have to do with "Have you been diagnosed with, or experienced symptoms of……" on an application.
I bow to your superior knowledge. (-: (For those who don’t know us: I’m not twitting Marilee. She works in the insurance industry and really *does* have superior knowledge!) –Pat Kight kig…@peak.org
Response:
Yes yes yes yes I have **exactly** the same problem!! Fortunately, I have known my doctor for ten years and he is very much willing to "not document" things. I believe you have the right under doctor-patient privilege to make this request, although I do not know the law. If your doctor will not do this, you might try (if you can afford it and want meds of a kind not covered) the tactic I used: go to another doctor, have the Rx filled at a different drugstore, don’t give them your SSN, and pay for it out of pocket. My regular doctor knows about this now, after the fact. best wishes and let us know how this turns our. RuthJ. (posted & mailed) – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Mink wrote:
I have a doctor appt. Friday to have a mole removed, and to discuss some medications I am taking. I am having a slight problem with depression, although I am feeling 99% better now. The problem is that if I discuss depression with my doctor, I am afraid she will document this in my medical file, and if my new insurance company finds out anything about depression (although I have never had a problem with this until Feb., and have never taken anti-depressants – and I don’t want to be prescribed any) they could very well cancel my coverage. Please keep in mind that I am on an individual health insurance plan, and they seldom covers services for depression let alone meds. It certainly is not like the group plans I used to be on. Is it proper to ask my dr. if I could talk about this without the conversation being written in my medical file? Has anyone ever had such request, and what was the outcome? Kate
Response:
"Marilee" <mae…@polarcomm.com
wrote in message
news:aesll2$9op16$1@ID-76373.news.dfncis.de… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> "gs" <gs1276_nos…@charter.net
wrote in message
> news:uh2srjl0elsi7d@corp.supernews.com… > > "Mink" <Bas…@televar.com
wrote in message
> > news:3D116764.32D3180A@televar.com… > > > > > >snipped<<<<<< > Is it proper to ask my dr. if I could talk about this without > the > > > conversation being written in my medical file? > > Yes, you can ask your doctor. Explain your concerns regarding the > possible > > cancellation of your health insurance. > But purposely hiding information *can* be considered fraud.
I explained that my situation was different. No where on any doctor’s form or insurance form that I’ve seen, does it ask about sexual abuse. I do answer questions regarding depression. When the doctor asks about the diagnosis, I give appropriate answers, I don’t lie or leave things out. The sexual abuse is only part of the picture and is left out due to respecting my privacy. It is noted that I grew up in an extreme dysfunctional alcoholic family. I am luckier than most since my major health concerns manifested long after the abuse and after it was dealt with. Gwen – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -
Marilee Has anyone ever had such request, and what was the outcome? My doctor did this regarding childhood sexual abuse. I realize it isn’t the same thing, but it was done so the insurance company wouldn’t have the information. Gwen Kate
Response:
"Linda Scheimann" <uscho…@yahoo.com
wrote in message
news:aet17h$9ns2t$1@ID-131262.news.dfncis.de…
I would not tell your doctor at this visit. For his own protection
he has to
document what he hears. He’s liable for what he knows whether he
writes it
down or not. I would not check the insurance coverage by asking the agent. The
agent has
no relationship of legal confidentiality and there’s no guarantee
he will
not pass the information on to the company. He does much more
business with
the company than he can hope to do with you.
Does much more business with? He’s usually under contract *with* the company. An agent has legal obligations to the company(ies) whose products he sells, and, indeed, can lose his license to sell insurance if he participates in any fraud, because knowingly withholding information that may affect a policy issue *is* fraud. That having been said, many people pose "hypothetical" questions to their agents in cases such as these, and a good agent gives an honest answer. Since he has no way of knowing if the question is about the person or their first cousin who is also shopping for insurance, he need not report it to the company. Lots of people call our office to ask hypotheticals, even if we’re not their insurers.
I would consider taking the depression issue to a local mental
health clinic
and simply paying the bill and keeping my own counsel. But if you
want
doctor patient confidentiality, I would see a psychiatrist, not a psychologist. That costs more money, but it buys legal
confidentiality. If, however, the cover-up is discovered later, (and legal confidentiality has nothing to do with anything if, at some point in the future, you ask your health insurance company to pay bills for something you knowingly kept from them) it can cause trouble. If, OTOH, you *never* ask your insurance company to pay said bills, then there’s no reason for them to request similar medical records. Marilee – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -
If you have a religious affiliation, I would consider talking to a clergyman. They do have legal confidentiality and they won’t be
asked for
medical information by anyone else. Also, they are less likely to
charge, if
at all. You only need a doctor if you need or want a prescription,
not for
talk therapy alone. It’s possible to find a clergyman with
counseling
training and certification. It does not have to be from your own
church.
Best wishes, Linda (not a lawyer, but some law credits, and more to the point, some
time in > therapy, married to Richard, clergyman) > Mink <Bas…@televar.com
wrote in message
> news:3D117BD6.BA27CEAE@televar.com… > > Thanks Gwen. Like you said, I basically don’t want my ins. co. to get
ahold of this info. If you type this on a search engine you will see where I am
coming from -
I think. LOL Type" Prozac may be hazardous to your health insurance". I
found it to be
a real eye opener as it relates to individual health insurance. Sorry, but I am not too computer savvy, and am not sure how to
post the > url. > > Thanks. > > Kate > > gs wrote: > > > "Mink" <Bas…@televar.com
wrote in message
> > > news:3D116764.32D3180A@televar.com… > > > > I have a doctor appt. Friday to have a mole removed, and to discuss
some medications I am taking. I am having a slight problem with depression, although I am
feeling
99% better now. The problem is that if I discuss depression with my doctor,
I am
afraid she will document this in my medical file, and if my new
insurance
company finds out anything about depression (although I have
never had
a problem with this until Feb., and have never taken
anti-depressants -
and I don’t want to be prescribed any) they could very well
cancel my
coverage. Please keep in mind that I am on an individual
health
insurance plan, and they seldom covers services for
depression let
alone meds. It certainly is not like the group plans I used to be on. Why would they cancel your insurance because you are
depressed? Does
your insurance list depression as a reason for cancellation?
Depression can
be a symptom of an underlying health problem. Anti depressants are prescribed as treatment for many
conditions, not
just depression. Any doctor can prescribe anti depressants. Many people with coverage go outside their insurance to
recieve mental
health treatment. Many people with health insurance don’t have
mental
health coverage (ex. therapy isn’t covered). Many insurance companies
that
don’t have mental health coverage, cover anti depressants. Check into your state’s laws regarding insurance. Checking
federal laws
wouldn’t be a bad idea either. Is it proper to ask my dr. if I could talk about this
without the
conversation being written in my medical file? Yes, you can ask your doctor. Explain your concerns regarding
the
possible cancellation of your health insurance. Has anyone ever had such request, and what was the outcome? My doctor did this regarding childhood sexual abuse. I realize
it isn’t
the same thing, but it was done so the insurance company wouldn’t
have the
information. Gwen Kate
Response:
I would not tell your doctor at this visit. For his own protection he has to document what he hears. He’s liable for what he knows whether he writes it down or not. I would not check the insurance coverage by asking the agent. The agent has no relationship of legal confidentiality and there’s no guarantee he will not pass the information on to the company. He does much more business with the company than he can hope to do with you. I would consider taking the depression issue to a local mental health clinic and simply paying the bill and keeping my own counsel. But if you want doctor patient confidentiality, I would see a psychiatrist, not a psychologist. That costs more money, but it buys legal confidentiality. If you have a religious affiliation, I would consider talking to a clergyman. They do have legal confidentiality and they won’t be asked for medical information by anyone else. Also, they are less likely to charge, if at all. You only need a doctor if you need or want a prescription, not for talk therapy alone. It’s possible to find a clergyman with counseling training and certification. It does not have to be from your own church. Best wishes, Linda (not a lawyer, but some law credits, and more to the point, some time in therapy, married to Richard, clergyman) Mink <Bas…@televar.com
wrote in message
news:3D117BD6.BA27CEAE@televar.com… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -
Thanks Gwen. Like you said, I basically don’t want my ins. co. to get
ahold of
this info. If you type this on a search engine you will see where I am coming from –
I
think. LOL Type" Prozac may be hazardous to your health insurance". I found it to be
a
real eye opener as it relates to individual health insurance. Sorry, but I am not too computer savvy, and am not sure how to post the
url. > Thanks. > Kate > gs wrote: > > "Mink" <Bas…@televar.com
wrote in message
> > news:3D116764.32D3180A@televar.com… > > > I have a doctor appt. Friday to have a mole removed, and to discuss some
medications I am taking. I am having a slight problem with depression, although I am feeling
99%
better now. The problem is that if I discuss depression with my doctor, I am
afraid
she will document this in my medical file, and if my new insurance company finds out anything about depression (although I have never had
a
problem with this until Feb., and have never taken anti-depressants – and I don’t want to be prescribed any) they could very well cancel my coverage. Please keep in mind that I am on an individual health insurance plan, and they seldom covers services for depression let
alone
meds. It certainly is not like the group plans I used to be on. Why would they cancel your insurance because you are depressed? Does
your
insurance list depression as a reason for cancellation? Depression can
be a
symptom of an underlying health problem. Anti depressants are prescribed as treatment for many conditions, not
just
depression. Any doctor can prescribe anti depressants. Many people with coverage go outside their insurance to recieve mental health treatment. Many people with health insurance don’t have mental
health
coverage (ex. therapy isn’t covered). Many insurance companies that
don’t
have mental health coverage, cover anti depressants. Check into your state’s laws regarding insurance. Checking federal laws wouldn’t be a bad idea either. Is it proper to ask my dr. if I could talk about this without the conversation being written in my medical file? Yes, you can ask your doctor. Explain your concerns regarding the
possible
cancellation of your health insurance. Has anyone ever had such request, and what was the outcome? My doctor did this regarding childhood sexual abuse. I realize it isn’t
the
same thing, but it was done so the insurance company wouldn’t have the information. Gwen Kate
Response:
I have a doctor appt. Friday to have a mole removed, and to discuss some medications I am taking. I am having a slight problem with depression, although I am feeling 99% better now. The problem is that if I discuss depression with my doctor, I am afraid she will document this in my medical file, and if my new insurance company finds out anything about depression (although I have never had a problem with this until Feb., and have never taken anti-depressants – and I don’t want to be prescribed any) they could very well cancel my coverage. Please keep in mind that I am on an individual health insurance plan, and they seldom covers services for depression let alone meds. It certainly is not like the group plans I used to be on. Is it proper to ask my dr. if I could talk about this without the conversation being written in my medical file? Has anyone ever had such request, and what was the outcome? Kate
Response:
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -
From: Mink Bas…@televar.com Date: 6/19/02 10:15 PM Pacific Daylight Time I have a doctor appt. Friday to have a mole removed, and to discuss some medications I am taking. I am having a slight problem with depression, although I am feeling 99% better now. The problem is that if I discuss depression with my doctor, I am afraid she will document this in my medical file, and if my new insurance company finds out anything about depression (although I have never had a problem with this until Feb., and have never taken anti-depressants – and I don’t want to be prescribed any) they could very well cancel my coverage. Please keep in mind that I am on an individual health insurance plan, and they seldom covers services for depression let alone meds. It certainly is not like the group plans I used to be on. Is it proper to ask my dr. if I could talk about this without the conversation being written in my medical file? Has anyone ever had such request, and what was the outcome? Kate
Check into the legalities. I think there is some protection against cancelling one for certain reasons. If I were you,I would start with Google and then also call the Attorney General. I’m sure someone will come along with better ideas. Good luck to you. Sharon….the problem is either in the hippocampus or the amygdala
Response:
"Mink" <Bas…@televar.com
wrote in message
news:3D116764.32D3180A@televar.com…
I have a doctor appt. Friday to have a mole removed, and to discuss some medications I am taking. I am having a slight problem with depression, although I am feeling 99% better now. The problem is that if I discuss depression with my doctor, I am afraid she will document this in my medical file, and if my new insurance company finds out anything about depression (although I have never had a problem with this until Feb., and have never taken anti-depressants – and I don’t want to be prescribed any) they could very well cancel my coverage. Please keep in mind that I am on an individual health insurance plan, and they seldom covers services for depression let alone meds. It certainly is not like the group plans I used to be on.
Why would they cancel your insurance because you are depressed? Does your insurance list depression as a reason for cancellation? Depression can be a symptom of an underlying health problem. Anti depressants are prescribed as treatment for many conditions, not just depression. Any doctor can prescribe anti depressants. Many people with coverage go outside their insurance to recieve mental health treatment. Many people with health insurance don’t have mental health coverage (ex. therapy isn’t covered). Many insurance companies that don’t have mental health coverage, cover anti depressants. Check into your state’s laws regarding insurance. Checking federal laws wouldn’t be a bad idea either.
Is it proper to ask my dr. if I could talk about this without the conversation being written in my medical file?
Yes, you can ask your doctor. Explain your concerns regarding the possible cancellation of your health insurance.
Has anyone ever had such request, and what was the outcome?
My doctor did this regarding childhood sexual abuse. I realize it isn’t the same thing, but it was done so the insurance company wouldn’t have the information. Gwen – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -
Kate
Response:
I start this new insurance plan eff. July 1, and I had to answer a question as to whether or not I have been diagnosed with depression during the past ten years. When I sent the app. in five weeks ago, the answer was no. But, I want to get one more appt. in before I start on my new plan, and if the dr. puts "depression" in my file, well, then I basically lied on the app., even though it happened after I sent in the form. But, I will take your good advice and check further. Many thanks. Kate – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Frankenmel wrote:
From: Mink Bas…@televar.com Date: 6/19/02 10:15 PM Pacific Daylight Time I have a doctor appt. Friday to have a mole removed, and to discuss some medications I am taking. I am having a slight problem with depression, although I am feeling 99% better now. The problem is that if I discuss depression with my doctor, I am afraid she will document this in my medical file, and if my new insurance company finds out anything about depression (although I have never had a problem with this until Feb., and have never taken anti-depressants – and I don’t want to be prescribed any) they could very well cancel my coverage. Please keep in mind that I am on an individual health insurance plan, and they seldom covers services for depression let alone meds. It certainly is not like the group plans I used to be on. Is it proper to ask my dr. if I could talk about this without the conversation being written in my medical file? Has anyone ever had such request, and what was the outcome? Kate Check into the legalities. I think there is some protection against cancelling one for certain reasons. If I were you,I would start with Google and then also call the Attorney General. I’m sure someone will come along with better ideas. Good luck to you. Sharon….the problem is either in the hippocampus or the amygdala
Response:
Thanks Gwen. Like you said, I basically don’t want my ins. co. to get ahold of this info. If you type this on a search engine you will see where I am coming from – I think. LOL Type" Prozac may be hazardous to your health insurance". I found it to be a real eye opener as it relates to individual health insurance. Sorry, but I am not too computer savvy, and am not sure how to post the url. Thanks. Kate – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -gs wrote:
"Mink" <Bas…@televar.com wrote in message news:3D116764.32D3180A@televar.com… I have a doctor appt. Friday to have a mole removed, and to discuss some medications I am taking. I am having a slight problem with depression, although I am feeling 99% better now. The problem is that if I discuss depression with my doctor, I am afraid she will document this in my medical file, and if my new insurance company finds out anything about depression (although I have never had a problem with this until Feb., and have never taken anti-depressants – and I don’t want to be prescribed any) they could very well cancel my coverage. Please keep in mind that I am on an individual health insurance plan, and they seldom covers services for depression let alone meds. It certainly is not like the group plans I used to be on. Why would they cancel your insurance because you are depressed? Does your insurance list depression as a reason for cancellation? Depression can be a symptom of an underlying health problem. Anti depressants are prescribed as treatment for many conditions, not just depression. Any doctor can prescribe anti depressants. Many people with coverage go outside their insurance to recieve mental health treatment. Many people with health insurance don’t have mental health coverage (ex. therapy isn’t covered). Many insurance companies that don’t have mental health coverage, cover anti depressants. Check into your state’s laws regarding insurance. Checking federal laws wouldn’t be a bad idea either. Is it proper to ask my dr. if I could talk about this without the conversation being written in my medical file? Yes, you can ask your doctor. Explain your concerns regarding the possible cancellation of your health insurance. Has anyone ever had such request, and what was the outcome? My doctor did this regarding childhood sexual abuse. I realize it isn’t the same thing, but it was done so the insurance company wouldn’t have the information. Gwen Kate
Response:
"Mink" <Bas…@televar.com
wrote in message
news:3D116764.32D3180A@televar.com… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -
I have a doctor appt. Friday to have a mole removed, and to
discuss some
medications I am taking. I am having a slight problem with depression, although I am
feeling 99%
better now. The problem is that if I discuss depression with my doctor, I am
afraid
she will document this in my medical file, and if my new insurance company finds out anything about depression (although I have never
had a
problem with this until Feb., and have never taken
anti-depressants -
and I don’t want to be prescribed any) they could very well cancel
my
coverage. Please keep in mind that I am on an individual health insurance plan, and they seldom covers services for depression let
alone
meds. It certainly is not like the group plans I used to be on. Is it proper to ask my dr. if I could talk about this without the conversation being written in my medical file? Has anyone ever had such request, and what was the outcome? Kate
I don’t know what state you live in, but I *do* know something about insurance applications. Your answer of "no" was not a lie. Your answer was truthful at the time the application was taken. The thing that is -likely- to happen is that the insurance company will put a waiver on your policy for treatment of depression. They’ll consider the depression a pre-existing condition, and tell you (and probably require you to sign something) that they won’t pay for anything that relates to the depression. Different companies have different things that make a person uninsurable; some are no-brainers, like cancer. Others aren’t "filed" to do waivers, and they must cancel. The state office to contact is not the Attorney General, but the Insurance Commissioner. (Sharon was not far off, but the Attorney General usually oversees other businesses.) A visit to your state government’s home page will likely give you phone numbers. If you need any help, e-mail me. BTW, I work in an insurance agency, and deal with this type of thing pretty often. Marilee – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –
Response:
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