Question:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/health/4268964.stm — Alison Chaiken                  "From:" address above is valid. (650) 236-2231 [daytime]        http://www.wsrcc.com/alison/ Predators fail often; prey fail only once. — Tom Evslin

Response:

http://www.nytimes.com/2005/09/21/health/21cnd-bird.html?ex=128495520… — Alison Chaiken                  "From:" address above is valid. (650) 236-2231 [daytime]        http://www.wsrcc.com/alison/ Predators fail often; prey fail only once. — Tom Evslin

Response:

sedum41 wrote:

I religiously wash my hands with hot soapy water for several minutes after I go in public. I use hand santizers when I can’t get to wash my hands right away. I wear white cotten gloves or winter gloves when I do have to go to a store. Wash these gloves regularily. If going to a doctor’s office in winter, don’t touch anything in the office (not the magazines, newspapers, chair handles). Bring your own book or magazine to read. Again wash hands throughly after leaving there. Don’t touch your face, eyes, mouth. If a family member has the flu, have them us their own hand towels in the bathroom.

No, handwashing doesn’t prevent the flu as well as it can prevent the common cold.  Perhaps you were only exposed to very bad cold viruses, not true influenza?  From the studies I’ve seen, unlike the common cold, influenza is spread mostly by *small* droplet infection, not *large* droplet infection. Small droplets linger in the air for a long time and you get infected by inhaling those droplets. Many (though not all) strains of the common cold seem to be carried by *large* droplet infection.  Large droplets tend to settle out of the air quickly and fall on environmental surfaces (or get sneezed or coughed onto an environmental surface).  That’s why it’s easier to catch the common cold by touching your contaminated hands to your nose or eyes than by breathing in the germs. A better strategy to minimize exposure to the flu is fresh air.  Even in winter, when temperatures are below freezing outdoors, I *always* keep a window open at least a crack.  The higher heating bill is a small price to pay. — Steven D. Litvintchouk Email:  sdlit…@earthlinkNOSPAM.net Remove the NOSPAM before replying to me.

Response:

I luckily have never had the flu. I’ve only gotten the flu shot once in my life so I have relied on other means to prevent it. I think most people can avoid the flu with common sense approaches. During flu season I avoid heavily traveled stores (think discount and big). Too many people, kids, stores are hot, germs on the shopping cart handles and at the check out counter.  I religiously wash my hands with hot soapy water for several minutes after I go in public. I use hand santizers when I can’t get to wash my hands right away. I wear white cotten gloves or winter gloves when I do have to go to a store. Wash these gloves regularily. If going to a doctor’s office in winter, don’t touch anything in the office (not the magazines, newspapers, chair handles). Bring your own book or magazine to read. Again wash hands throughly after leaving there. Don’t touch your face, eyes, mouth. If a family member has the flu, have them us their own hand towels in the bathroom. I know what I’ve written sounds paranoid and a little obsessive compulsive but it has worked for me! PS Yes the bird flu is scary but I can’t panic about something that I have no control over.

Response:

"Don Brady" <dbr…@pobox.com

wrote in message

news:3adui1dh1ukc87mffidj4ulqjbssjqov6j@4ax.com… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -

On 19 Sep 2005 08:26:49 -0700, "00doc" <00…@comcast.net wrote: That was an excellent post. However, just to comment broiefly on one point: To my knowledge none of the agents has been shown to be more effective than any of the others. I can’t imagine there has been enough human disease for anyone to be experienced enough to really know. The main advantage of Tamiflu is that it covers type B, which is not an issue in this case. It is much more expensive that the other pills which makes me wonder about the motivation of these people selling it. News accounts do say: "Oseltamivir, known commercially as Tamiflu, is the only treatment proven to be effective against bird flu in humans."

You do have a point but the above is not true either. Nothing has been proved effective in humans. There have simply not been enough cases and most of the cases that have been detected have been in farmers in rural asia who did not recieve effective antivirals of any kind early enough to expect to make a real difference. In laboratory experiments Tamiflu has been shown to be effective in mice while some of the strains tested have been resistant to amantadine and rimantadine. BTW – there is another neuraminidase inhibitor on the market (Relenza) but it is even more expensive, is inhaled, and has been known to cause bronchospasm so it is relatively contraindicated in people with lung disease (like asthma).

and the U.S. governmenti is reported today to be placing a one billion dollar order for a stockpile of the drug.   I have to think that they would buy one of the cheaper anivirals if they thought that they were as effective and safe..

I’m sure the lab data has a lot to do with it – although like I said, no one really knows what effect the drugs will have. Parital effectiveness may be enough to slow down the spread and turn a fatal disease into a severe but survivable one. On a related note(s): The government says it is planning to stockpile 20 million doses of Tamiflu and 20 million doses of the newly developed vaccine. The reality is that they have only ordered 450,000 doses of vaccine so there seems to be some kind of disconnect there. Strong antibody responses have been obtained in humans but since no vaccinated person has ever been exposed to the virus no one knows how effective it might be. The problem is that stockpiled vaccine will not likely be an exact match for whatever strian emerges so the immunity will likely only be partial. Many models of spread suggest that 120,000 courses of treatment will probably be enough to quell an outbreak. Of course, this assumes the assumptions regarding the behavior of the virus are correct, that the governments respond apprpriately within 2-3 weeks of detection, and that it occurs in relatively rural south east asia and not Kuala Lampur, Bangkok, or Los Angeles. Since the virus has been found in migratory waterfowl that may not show symptoms I’m especially not optomistic about the last assumption. — 00doc

Response:

On Mon, 19 Sep 2005 11:42:15 GMT, "mcs" <m…@yahoo.com

wrote: so without going to drugstore.com, , is that a reliable vendor?

I tihnk they are reliable.  Ther are others that are a bit cheaper but they are mostly Canadian etc.

 Is paying 600 dollars something people are doing?

Most people probably just o rder one ($66) but soem are ordering several at least.,

Will they get good product as opposed to counterfeit?

No counterfeiting of Tamiflu has been reported to date.   It comes in a blister pack and packaging that wouldot be easy to counterfeit.  Really if you buy from a pharmacist in the U.S, or Canada or Germany your exposure to counterfeiting is minimal.

Response:

I had a sinus infection last year and I got a Nurse P. I asked her if I could get the Flu shot there, she said as I was under my doctors care for heart problems (stroke 10 years a ago) that I could get it. So I went back after I felt better and got the flu shot in November. shirley

Response:

so without going to drugstore.com, , is that a reliable vendor?  Is paying 600 dollars something people are doing? Will they get good product as opposed to counterfeit? "Don Brady" <dbr…@pobox.com

wrote in message

news:o1esi1tdtqt9bktvqqoannlmoebrn72uk7@4ax.com… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -

On Mon, 19 Sep 2005 02:51:48 GMT, Alison Chaiken <alison+gnus20050918T194…@dailyplanet.dontspam.wsrcc.com wrote: Roche’s website (www.rocheusa.com/programs/TamifluChain2002.pdf) says that the shelf life of Tamiflu is 3 years.  I’m not sure how many doses a patient might take per day, but 100 sounds like a lot given that the maximum extent of flu is 2 weeks in my experience. The recommended  dose to treat flu in general is 2 per day for 5 days, for a total of 10. It seems from experimental data that longer (and maybe a higher dose) would be better for bird flu. But you can also take it during the "flu season" to prevent flu.   It is approved also for that purpose.  For that purpose,  the recommended dose is one per day..    Some authors have advised planning on taking it throughout each of the posited 3 waves of a possible pandemic.   That could take you to about 100.

Response:

On Mon, 19 Sep 2005 17:31:32 -0400, Don Brady <dbr…@pobox.com

wrote: On Mon, 19 Sep 2005 11:42:15 GMT, "mcs" <m…@yahoo.com wrote: so without going to drugstore.com, , is that a reliable vendor? I tihnk they are reliable.  Ther are others that are a bit cheaper but they are mostly Canadian etc.

Actually the others are *much* cheaper for larger quantities.

Response:

There are two broad types of influenza (with many subtypes each – hence the reformulated vaccine every year) A and B. All the available meds are active against type A flu’s but most flu medications do not cover type B; which is not so bad because almost all flu that goes around each year is type A. The Avian flu’s that have been detected are type A. The vaccine usually contains three strains – two A’s and one B. The fear of a pandemic is because the avian flu has the "H5" subtype which is similar to the pandemic strain if 1918 and has had a high fatality rate in the few humans who have gotten it. The good news is that there has been little to no human to human transmission so far. The bad news is that that capability may just be a mutation or two away. The estimates I have seen usually suggets more like a 20% mortality rate (which could still be a disaster of Biblical proportions) but I think at this point they are all just guessing. To answer Alison’s question: Presumably if a pandemic hit the people who are stockpiling the meds would want to use it prophylactally  - taking one pill daily to keep the flu away – rather than just keep it around for treatment. In that case 100 pills may not be enough. To my knowledge none of the agents has been shown to be more effective than any of the others. I can’t imagine there has been enough human disease for anyone to be experienced enough to really know. The main advantage of Tamiflu is that it covers type B, which is not an issue in this case. It is much more expensive that the other pills which makes me wonder about the motivation of these people selling it. Amantidine does have more side effects, particularly in the elderly (mostly neuropsychiatric). Rimatidine would be a good compromise on effectiveness, cost, and side effects. One should keep in mind that while the vaccine is a biological that must be grown in culture and so production cannot easily be started or increased this is not true of the meds we are discussing. Considering that there are four different meds available (in the US), that two of them are out as generics and so have several manufacturers, and that as non-biological agents production can be increased relatively easily I think the risk of not having enough meds to treat the high risk groups at least is small. The bigger risk is that there will not be a vaccine and the meds will not be as effective as we would like.

Response:

On 19 Sep 2005 08:26:49 -0700, "00doc" <00…@comcast.net

wrote:

That was an excellent post.   However, just to comment broiefly on one point:

To my knowledge none of the agents has been shown to be more effective than any of the others. I can’t imagine there has been enough human disease for anyone to be experienced enough to really know. The main advantage of Tamiflu is that it covers type B, which is not an issue in this case. It is much more expensive that the other pills which makes me wonder about the motivation of these people selling it.

News accounts do say: "Oseltamivir, known commercially as Tamiflu, is the only treatment proven to be effective against bird flu in humans." (AP 8/27/05) and the U.S. governmenti is reported today to be placing a one billion dollar order for a stockpile of the drug.   I have to think that they would buy one of the cheaper anivirals if they thought that they were as effective and safe..

Response:

On Sun, 18 Sep 2005 16:28:34 -0700, "SJF" <S…@nospam.com

wrote: My layman’s reading, Google and a product information slip which accompanied an old prescription, is that there are several other antivirals on the market which have similar effects on influenza A viruses.  None have actually been demonstrated effective on bird flu but perhaps they may be presumed to be effective against that influenza A virus. Checking Drugstore.com, I note that the price for Tamiflu is about $600 for 100, for Amantadine (patent has long since expired) it is about $30 for 100. There may be some differences in dosage and effectiveness (the latter apparently not established) but it makes one wonder if there has been some drug industry inspired hype to promote another me-to product.  It wouldn’t be the first time. SJF

Amantadine and  Relenza are promising against Bird flu too.  Amantadine is indeed much cheaper. According to http://www.recombinomics.com/News/09170502/Tamiflu_Amantadine_Prevent…

The emphasis on Tamiflu is due to the fact that the H5N1 isolated from patients in Vietnam and Thailand was amantadine resistant, so the only class of antivirals available was the neuramindase inhibitors, and only Tamiflu was readily available.

Amantadine may have more side effects.  Someone said that but I am not sure if it is true. Many people are ordering Anantadine too.  I will do that also, The best thing may be a combo of the two, in the event someone does come down with bird flu (at which point odds of living are only 50-50).  They work on different principle and so can complement each other.

Response:

What might you gentlemen all consider best, maybe the Titanic revisited, mothers and children first, younger able bodied people say up to 30 next, and the rest might  be most interesting.  Noah calls the shots! And the Tamiflu stuff still remains in the maybe category! What is the bet the political boys would get a boat!! What is the bet the Tamiflu stuff is really being counterfeited with great gusto! I was under the impression that India was one of the major sources for bogus drugs. Merlin.

Response:

"SJF" <S…@nospam.com

writes: Checking Drugstore.com, I note that the price for Tamiflu is about $600 for 100,

Roche’s website (www.rocheusa.com/programs/TamifluChain2002.pdf) says that the shelf life of Tamiflu is 3 years.  I’m not sure how many doses a patient might take per day, but 100 sounds like a lot given that the maximum extent of flu is 2 weeks in my experience. — Alison Chaiken                  "From:" address above is valid. (650) 236-2231 [daytime]        http://www.wsrcc.com/alison/ Predators fail often; prey fail only once. — Tom Evslin

Response:

On Mon, 19 Sep 2005 02:51:48 GMT, Alison Chaiken <alison+gnus20050918T194…@dailyplanet.dontspam.wsrcc.com

wrote: Roche’s website (www.rocheusa.com/programs/TamifluChain2002.pdf) says that the shelf life of Tamiflu is 3 years.  I’m not sure how many doses a patient might take per day, but 100 sounds like a lot given that the maximum extent of flu is 2 weeks in my experience.

The recommended  dose to treat flu in general is 2 per day for 5 days, for  a total of 10.   It seems from experimental data that longer (and maybe a higher dose) would be better for bird flu. But you can also take it during the "flu season" to prevent flu.   It is approved also for that purpose.  For that purpose,  the recommended dose is one per day..    Some authors have advised planning on taking it throughout each of the posited 3 waves of a possible pandemic.   That could take you to about 100.

Response:

"Don Brady" <dbr…@pobox.com

wrote in message

news:ncnpi1d7bjodm2p8rqeu0t07pmvihr9g41@4ax.com… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -

There could be a Bird Flu pandemic if it leaps to the human species, as many epidemiologists are predicting  (Or it could be some other kind of  flu). It may have a 40% death rate. If you start to come down with any kind of flu, take Tamiflu immediately. It is almost the only drug that can be used.   It can also prevent flu (in many cases) if you start taking it when and if a pandemic hits.  (Don’t take it until then though). Many countries are now ordering large stockpiles of Tamiflu.  Odds are that if there is a pandemic, you will not be able to get it unless you are in a priority category. So many people are getting a stock in advance now.   That includes me.   I just ordered some from http://www.pharmaenergy.com/drugs/influenza/ .  That may be technically illegal for U.S. residents but small personal imports are tolerated.  That company will arrange for a German doctor to write you a prescription, included in the price.  That is almost the only (so far) reliable company that will still do that for Tamiflu – I have searched far and wide and read discussion groups that share experiences on this topic). Other alternatives include your local doctor and pharmacy (at a higher price probably), or the Canadian Internet You have been warned…… (I have no connection to these products or companies – I just dread the effect that a flu epidemic would have on sinus and asthma sufferers).

My layman’s reading, Google and a product information slip which accompanied an old prescription, is that there are several other antivirals on the market which have similar effects on influenza A viruses.  None have actually been demonstrated effective on bird flu but perhaps they may be presumed to be effective against that influenza A virus. Checking Drugstore.com, I note that the price for Tamiflu is about $600 for 100, for Amantadine (patent has long since expired) it is about $30 for 100. There may be some differences in dosage and effectiveness (the latter apparently not established) but it makes one wonder if there has been some drug industry inspired hype to promote another me-to product.  It wouldn’t be the first time. SJF

Response:

On 18 Sep 2005 00:06:02 -0700, "Merlin" <la…@tpg.com.au

wrote: G’day Don, yes this raises another really interesting situation where there are so many bogus laboratories producing packaged drugs which are in fact completely counterfeit and commonly have no active ingredients at all. One interesting case was where a yank medical surgical team were involved in a South African country as volunteer doctors, the surgical operations went well but the patients started dying. When it was discovered the drugs used in the hospital were counterfiet the team packed up and went home. So things may not be as they seem with these bogus drugs.

It is indeed a possibility in general but I believe that the source I mentioned is ok at this time. See the discussions at http://www.curevents.com/vb/showthread.php?t=20275 .

My advice was that there was no known effective drug available at this time for this kind of flu. Are you quite sure your information is correct.

Yes, see http://www.recombinomics.com/News/09160501/Tamiflu_Primetime.html and the ABC News article at http://abcnews.go.com/Primetime/Investigation/story?id=1130392&page=1 and many other news stories.

Response:

On Sun, 18 Sep 2005 06:06:28 -0400, brewc…@webtv.net (shirley brewer) wrote:

Don is Tamiflu just for young people?

No it is used to treat people of any age who catch the flu.  It can also be used to prevent severe flu for those who cannot be vaccinated.

They were recommending a nasal mist last year but it was not for people over 65.

In fact, they will not give the nasal mist to anyone over 50.    People over 50 but under 65 could not get *any* flu vaccine last  year until late in the season when demand died off.   Some people in their 50’s lied and said they were under 50 in order to get the nasal mist.  The nasal mist was always in plentiful supply (and is actually fine for those over 50 if you look at the research or talk to the company, as I did). We are in excatly the same situation this year.  Flu shots start Oct. 1 for those over 65 or with certain chronic health conditions (sinusitis alone not included, but asthma is).   The restrictions are supposed to be loosened Oct. 24th if supply and demand warrant.  

Response:

On Sun, 18 Sep 2005 15:29:57 GMT, "Steven L." <sdlit…@earthlinkNOSPAM.net

wrote:

But it’s precisely because I have asthma that I am in a priority category. Remember the flu shot shortage last fall?  When I told The Powers That Be that I had asthma (and showed them a confirming note from my asthma specialist), they fast-tracked me right to the top of the flu shot list and I got my shot immediately.  In fact, I got my flu shot ahead of 80 year old men and women.

Yes asthma sufferers were in the priority category for flu shots last year, and are again this year. (People who do not have asthma, such as myself, are not). But if there is a flu pandemic, there may or may not be enough Tamiflu at that time to include them all.   http://abcnews.go.com/Primetime/Investigation/story?id=1130392&page=3

While there is no vaccine to stop the flu, there is one medicine to treat it. Called Tamiflu, it is made by the Roche pharmaceutical company in Switzerland. Roche has been selling Tamiflu for years. Only recently, however, did scientists learn of its potential to work against the killer flu, H5N1. That has since created a huge demand and a critical shortage. "All of the wealthiest countries in the world are trying to purchase stockpiles of Tamiflu," says Garrett. "Our current stockpile is around 2.5 million courses of treatment." According to Leavitt, that is a long way from the country’s ideal stockpile. "Our objective is to have 20 million doses of Tamiflu or enough for 20 million people," he says. He later admitted that only 2 million are currently on hand, but asserted that no other country is in a better position.

The government calculationa are also way over-optimistic – see http://www.recombinomics.com/News/09160501/Tamiflu_Primetime.html Also for prophylactic use (to prevent or mitigate the severity of the flu before you get it) after a pandemic starts, you are not going to be able to get it once a shortage develops (which cold be imminent).

Response:

Merlin wrote:

G’day Don, yes this raises another really interesting situation where there are so many bogus laboratories producing packaged drugs which are in fact completely counterfeit and commonly have no active ingredients at all.

"Frontline" did an episode on Chinese counterfeits.  The Chinese are counterfeiting just about everything manufactured in the West, from designer-name golf clubs to pharmaceuticals, and that stuff has spread onto international websites.  And of course, the Chinese counterfeit drugs are often worthless, containing no active ingredients. — Steven D. Litvintchouk Email:  sdlit…@earthlinkNOSPAM.net Remove the NOSPAM before replying to me.

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Don Brady wrote:

There could be a Bird Flu pandemic if it leaps to the human species, as many epidemiologists are predicting  (Or it could be some other kind of  flu). It may have a 40% death rate. If you start to come down with any kind of flu, take Tamiflu immediately.   It is almost the only drug that can be used.   It can also prevent flu (in many cases) if you start taking it when and if a pandemic hits.  (Don’t take it until then though). Many countries are now ordering large stockpiles of Tamiflu.  Odds are that if there is a pandemic, you will not be able to get it unless you are in a priority category…. . . . . (I have no connection to these products or companies – I just dread the effect that a flu epidemic would have on sinus and asthma sufferers).

But it’s precisely because I have asthma that I am in a priority category. Remember the flu shot shortage last fall?  When I told The Powers That Be that I had asthma (and showed them a confirming note from my asthma specialist), they fast-tracked me right to the top of the flu shot list and I got my shot immediately.  In fact, I got my flu shot ahead of 80 year old men and women. — Steven D. Litvintchouk Email:  sdlit…@earthlinkNOSPAM.net Remove the NOSPAM before replying to me.

Response:

Don is Tamiflu just for young people? They were recommending a nasal mist last year but it was not for people over 65. shirley

Response:

"Merlin" <la…@tpg.com.au

wrote in message

news:1127027161.979079.193720@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -

G’day Don, yes this raises another really interesting situation where there are so many bogus laboratories producing packaged drugs which are in fact completely counterfeit and commonly have no active ingredients at all. One interesting case was where a yank medical surgical team were involved in a South African country as volunteer doctors, the surgical operations went well but the patients started dying. When it was discovered the drugs used in the hospital were counterfiet the team packed up and went home. So things may not be as they seem with these bogus drugs. My advice was that there was no known effective drug available at this time for this kind of flu. Are you quite sure your information is correct. Cheers, qldit. Good Question but maybe one too many .

Response:

There could be a Bird Flu pandemic if it leaps to the human species, as many epidemiologists are predicting  (Or it could be some other kind of  flu). It may have a 40% death rate. If you start to come down with any kind of flu, take Tamiflu immediately.   It is almost the only drug that can be used.   It can also prevent flu (in many cases) if you start taking it when and if a pandemic hits.  (Don’t take it until then though). Many countries are now ordering large stockpiles of Tamiflu.  Odds are that if there is a pandemic, you will not be able to get it unless you are in a priority category. So many people are getting a stock in advance now.   That includes me.   I just ordered some from http://www.pharmaenergy.com/drugs/influenza/ .  That may be technically illegal for U.S. residents but small personal imports are tolerated.  That company will arrange for a German doctor to write you a prescription, included in the price.  That is almost the only (so far) reliable company that will still do that for Tamiflu – I have searched far and wide and read discussion groups that share experiences on this topic). Other alternatives include your local doctor and pharmacy (at a higher price probably), or the Canadian Internet You have been warned…… (I have no connection to these products or companies – I just dread the effect that a flu epidemic would have on sinus and asthma sufferers).

Response:

G’day Don, yes this raises another really interesting situation where there are so many bogus laboratories producing packaged drugs which are in fact completely counterfeit and commonly have no active ingredients at all. One interesting case was where a yank medical surgical team were involved in a South African country as volunteer doctors, the surgical operations went well but the patients started dying. When it was discovered the drugs used in the hospital were counterfiet the team packed up and went home. So things may not be as they seem with these bogus drugs. My advice was that there was no known effective drug available at this time for this kind of flu. Are you quite sure your information is correct. Cheers, qldit.

Response:

Question:

Hi all I have a question regarding lung function and pneumonia for any of you with severe asthma. My son (4) has severe asthma and has just been recovering from pneumonia. Unfortunately he is still in the "yellow" zone as he is having nightly asthma attacks due to his pneumonia (despite taking high levels of the inhaled steroid pulmacort we have been giving it to him 5 time a day .5mg/ml the whole 2ml vial each time), he is up nightly and often needing 2 ventolin nebules "back to back" before a response is noted. He has even needed a third ventolin 2 hours later after this (and has on occasion been up every 1.5 -2 hours needing ventolin.(while he had the pneumonia)). The asthma specialist said this was "ok" as long as the interval 1.5 hours didn’t diminish…or continue during the day (as this happens only at night). What do you all think of this? How dangerous is it to administer ventolin that frequently? I am terrified for my son and have nearly taken him to the ER the last 3 nights after a delayed response to the 2 ventolin nebules administered. When do you go to the ER? Do you always wait for indrawing and other red zone symptoms? The pediatrician mentioned my son had lost some lung function  in his left lung due to the bout of pneumonia. Now  I know everyone is different, but is it reasonable to still be recovering from pneumonia 2 weeks after the antibiotic  was finished? Is it typical to lose lung function? and does it ever return? How long is too long (before one should start worrying) when recovering from pneumonia and having severe asthma. Thanks for any comments/ advice I really appreciate your help, as always. Vicky

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi all I have a question regarding lung function and pneumonia for any of you with severe asthma. My son (4) has severe asthma and has just been recovering from pneumonia. Unfortunately he is still in the "yellow" zone as he is having nightly asthma attacks due to his pneumonia (despite taking high levels of the inhaled steroid pulmacort we have been giving it to him 5 time a day .5mg/ml the whole 2ml vial each time), he is up nightly and often needing 2 ventolin nebules "back to back" before a response is noted. He has even needed a third ventolin 2 hours later after this (and has on occasion been up every 1.5 -2 hours needing ventolin.(while he had the pneumonia)). The asthma specialist said this was "ok" as long as the interval 1.5 hours didn’t diminish…or continue during the day (as this happens only at night). What do you all think of this? How dangerous is it to administer ventolin that frequently? I am terrified for my son and have nearly taken him to the ER the last 3 nights after a delayed response to the 2 ventolin nebules administered. When do you go to the ER? Do you always wait for indrawing and other red zone symptoms? The pediatrician mentioned my son had lost some lung function  in his left lung due to the bout of pneumonia. Now  I know everyone is different, but is it reasonable to still be recovering from pneumonia 2 weeks after the antibiotic  was finished? Is it typical to lose lung function? and does it ever return? How long is too long (before one should start worrying) when recovering from pneumonia and having severe asthma. Thanks for any comments/ advice I really appreciate your help, as always. Vicky

Did he have asthma before getting this bout of pneumonia and, if so, what was its severity and occurrence and what medication was he on? It may be that he is getting too much medicine for his asthma which can sometimes, for some individuals, make the condition worse. Also, some individuals show no improvement or even react adversely to one kind of asthma medicine but do well on others of the same class. So, switching to a different brand of medicine might also be an option to try. Always consult with the Doctor before changing anything, of course and I hope you get his asthma under control soon. Regards, Jeff

Response:

I don’t see any mention of him being given a course of liquid prednisone. In cases like this, a short course is often required to get things back on track. That has certainly been the case with my children when all other measures failed to achieve the required response. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi all I have a question regarding lung function and pneumonia for any of you with severe asthma. My son (4) has severe asthma and has just been recovering from pneumonia. Unfortunately he is still in the "yellow" zone as he is having nightly asthma attacks due to his pneumonia (despite taking high levels of the inhaled steroid pulmacort we have been giving it to him 5 time a day .5mg/ml the whole 2ml vial each time), he is up nightly and often needing 2 ventolin nebules "back to back" before a response is noted. He has even needed a third ventolin 2 hours later after this (and has on occasion been up every 1.5 -2 hours needing ventolin.(while he had the pneumonia)). The asthma specialist said this was "ok" as long as the interval 1.5 hours didn’t diminish…or continue during the day (as this happens only at night). What do you all think of this? How dangerous is it to administer ventolin that frequently? I am terrified for my son and have nearly taken him to the ER the last 3 nights after a delayed response to the 2 ventolin nebules administered. When do you go to the ER? Do you always wait for indrawing and other red zone symptoms? The pediatrician mentioned my son had lost some lung function  in his left lung due to the bout of pneumonia. Now  I know everyone is different, but is it reasonable to still be recovering from pneumonia 2 weeks after the antibiotic  was finished? Is it typical to lose lung function? and does it ever return? How long is too long (before one should start worrying) when recovering from pneumonia and having severe asthma. Thanks for any comments/ advice I really appreciate your help, as always. Vicky Did he have asthma before getting this bout of pneumonia and, if so, what was its severity and occurrence and what medication was he on? It may be that he is getting too much medicine for his asthma which can sometimes, for some individuals, make the condition worse. Also, some individuals show no improvement or even react adversely to one kind of asthma medicine but do well on others of the same class. So, switching to a different brand of medicine might also be an option to try. Always consult with the Doctor before changing anything, of course and I hope you get his asthma under control soon. Regards, Jeff

Response:

Question:

I would like to purchase a Flutter Device.  I’m willing to try just about anything to loosen up this sticky phlegm in my airways. Where are the best places with the best prices and the best models?  Any places to buy a Flutter Device online? — Steven D. Litvintchouk                  

Response:

go to Sandipharm or Scandipharm web site. They are the manufacturer. Murray Grossan, M.D. http://www.ent-consult.com http://www.TinnitusRelief.net http://www.emedicine.com/ent/topic516.htm

Response:

Steve: while waiting for the Flutter, practice a low pitched "OOOOOMMMMMMMM" This also shakes the mucus in the chest.  Try to imitate – loud  - those Tibetin horns. The lower pitch matches closer the 16/sec pulse rate of the cilia. – which the flutter tries to do too. Murray Grossan, M.D. http://www.ent-consult.com http://www.TinnitusRelief.net http://www.emedicine.com/ent/topic516.htm

Response:

Steve: while waiting for the Flutter, practice a low pitched "OOOOOMMMMMMMM" This also shakes the mucus in the chest.  Try to imitate – loud  - those Tibetin horns.

I’m sorry, I’ve never heard a Tibetin horn, I don’t understand what that means. But I’ll do the best I can. — Steven D. Litvintchouk                  

Response:

After you discover you’ve wasted $60 and finished with enduring the frustration ask your doctor to prescribe a nebulized mucolytic, and try using Alkalol as a gargle and nasal wash.  Sounds like your sinusitus, and probably some chronic bronchitis, is more contributory towards your discomfort than whatever asthma you have, if any… you just think you have asthma, as do most others with excessive airway mucous.

I was "officially" diagnosed with asthma by an asthma specialist, based largely on my symptoms (which included some wheezing in my lower lung lobes detectable thru the stethoscope).  The reasoning seemed to be that if I have a chronic chest cough, and I’ve never smoked, then it must be asthma rather than chronic bronchitis. I do not believe that the yellow phlegm is post nasal drip, if that’s what you’re implying.  I don’t have any discolored mucus when I irrigate my nasal passages.  All that discolored stuff seems to be coming up from the bronchial tubes or trachea. Besides, whether it’s asthma or chronic bronchitis, I don’t see what difference it really makes.  The meds and other therapies seem to be quite similar for both. — Steven D. Litvintchouk                  

Response:

Question:

Hi all, After all the whingeing I’ve done on this group about the service I get (or, more to the point, don’t) from my GP (big multi-quack set-up)….. ‘er indoors picked up my repeat script for test strips on Friday and came away laden with blood test envelopes and a letter basically telling me to get my ar$e down to their brand spanking new diabetes clinic. Apparently they are going to check my blood, urine, weight, feet, medication AND give me advice on diet! Blimey….perhaps they read this group?…do you think they might know my real name? <gulp…what are you going to do with that BIG needle Sister!…why do I have to bend over?…does DB make you paranoid? Later, Fred Feeling V E R Y strange today (i.e. almost human) – woke up with a reading of 5.0, only went up to 5.5 after lunch and was still at  5.5 before dinner! If it’s still below 6 tonight I’ll be checking my meter in the morning . Mmmmm, mind you, if the meter is OK, have you seen those really BIG Mars Bars….

Response:

Since I was diagnosed my doctors surgery runs its own clinic, nurses very good sorry helpful, six monthly checks chiropody the works and any problems I can be seen same day. Martin Perman

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi all, After all the whingeing I’ve done on this group about the service I get (or, more to the point, don’t) from my GP (big multi-quack set-up)….. ‘er indoors picked up my repeat script for test strips on Friday and came away laden with blood test envelopes and a letter basically telling me to get my ar$e down to their brand spanking new diabetes clinic. Apparently they are going to check my blood, urine, weight, feet, medication AND give me advice on diet! Blimey….perhaps they read this group?…do you think they might know my real name? <gulp…what are you going to do with that BIG needle Sister!…why do I have to bend over?…does DB make you paranoid? Later, Fred Feeling V E R Y strange today (i.e. almost human) – woke up with a reading of 5.0, only went up to 5.5 after lunch and was still at  5.5 before dinner! If it’s still below 6 tonight I’ll be checking my meter in the morning . Mmmmm, mind you, if the meter is OK, have you seen those really BIG Mars Bars…. Humph….10.1 two hours after dinner….BUGGER!

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi all, After all the whingeing I’ve done on this group about the service I get (or, more to the point, don’t) from my GP (big multi-quack set-up)….. ‘er indoors picked up my repeat script for test strips on Friday and came away laden with blood test envelopes and a letter basically telling me to get my ar$e down to their brand spanking new diabetes clinic. Apparently they are going to check my blood, urine, weight, feet, medication AND give me advice on diet! Blimey….perhaps they read this group?…do you think they might know my real name? <gulp…what are you going to do with that BIG needle Sister!…why do I have to bend over?…does DB make you paranoid? Later, Fred Feeling V E R Y strange today (i.e. almost human) – woke up with a reading of 5.0, only went up to 5.5 after lunch and was still at  5.5 before dinner! If it’s still below 6 tonight I’ll be checking my meter in the morning . Mmmmm, mind you, if the meter is OK, have you seen those really BIG Mars Bars….

Humph….10.1 two hours after dinner….BUGGER!

Response:

Hi all, After all the whingeing I’ve done on this group about the service I get (or, more to the point, don’t) from my GP (big multi-quack set-up)….. ‘er indoors picked up my repeat script for test strips on Friday and came away laden with blood test envelopes and a letter basically telling me to get my ar$e down to their brand spanking new diabetes clinic. Apparently they are going to check my blood, urine, weight, feet, medication AND give me advice on diet!

Good! You need all these things. Blimey….perhaps they read this group?…do you think they might know my real name? <gulp…what are you going to do with that BIG needle Sister!…why do I have to bend over?…does DB make you paranoid?

According to the National Service Framework for Diabetes, the intention is to move to an "Expert Patient" model of care, i.e. educating people with diabetes to the point that are well able to manage their condition day to day, and know when to call on expert help. So when that comes in, perhaps GP’s will be recommending people come here!! I have certainly learned more about diabetes from books and the net than I have from doctors and clinics. Feeling V E R Y strange today (i.e. almost human) – woke up with a reading of 5.0, only went up to 5.5 after lunch and was still at  5.5 before dinner! If it’s still below 6 tonight I’ll be checking my meter in the morning . Mmmmm, mind you, if the meter is OK, have you seen those really BIG Mars Bars….

Eating a large mars bar is a VERY good way to prove to yourslef that you are still diabetic!! BTW, if your tastes run to it, a Snickers bar has half the glycmic load of a mars bar. It should raise your BG roughly half as much. But that still doesn’t mean it’s a good idea to eat them every day! Barbara

Response:

what about the old advertising slogan then , a mars a day helps you work rest and play hummmmph, regards sandy

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi all, After all the whingeing I’ve done on this group about the service I get (or, more to the point, don’t) from my GP (big multi-quack set-up)….. ‘er indoors picked up my repeat script for test strips on Friday and came away laden with blood test envelopes and a letter basically telling me to get my ar$e down to their brand spanking new diabetes clinic. Apparently they are going to check my blood, urine, weight, feet, medication AND give me advice on diet! Good! You need all these things. Blimey….perhaps they read this group?…do you think they might know my real name? <gulp…what are you going to do with that BIG needle Sister!…why do I have to bend over?…does DB make you paranoid? According to the National Service Framework for Diabetes, the intention is to move to an "Expert Patient" model of care, i.e. educating people with diabetes to the point that are well able to manage their condition day to day, and know when to call on expert help. So when that comes in, perhaps GP’s will be recommending people come here!! I have certainly learned more about diabetes from books and the net than I have from doctors and clinics. Feeling V E R Y strange today (i.e. almost human) – woke up with a reading of 5.0, only went up to 5.5 after lunch and was still at  5.5 before dinner! If it’s still below 6 tonight I’ll be checking my meter in the morning . Mmmmm, mind you, if the meter is OK, have you seen those really BIG Mars Bars…. Eating a large mars bar is a VERY good way to prove to yourslef that you are still diabetic!! BTW, if your tastes run to it, a Snickers bar has half the glycmic load of a mars bar. It should raise your BG roughly half as much. But that still doesn’t mean it’s a good idea to eat them every day! Barbara

Response:

Since I was diagnosed my doctors surgery runs its own clinic, nurses very good sorry helpful, six monthly checks chiropody the works and any problems I can be seen same day.

hi peeps I’ve been diagnosed as type 2 for a whole ten days now…I’ve had tremendous treatment from the local health centre, barring the fact that I spotted the symptoms and suggested I be tested before my GP thought of it (I have a cousin and a close friend who are type 1 and my sister is type 2)…I’ve had an introductory session with a practise nurse (this will be weekly for a while), I’ve got a blood glucose test kit and have been shown how to use it (I’m starting testing from tomorrow morning), and I’ve just got a phone message to arrange an appointment with the chiropodist they’ve got in gear very quickly and seem to be offering me everything they should…so far I’m very impressed — eric "I am a man of many parts, unfortunately most of them are no longer in stock"

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Blimey….perhaps they read this group?…do you think they might know my real name? <gulp…what are you going to do with that BIG needle Sister!…why do I have to bend over?…does DB make you paranoid? According to the National Service Framework for Diabetes, the intention is to move to an "Expert Patient" model of care, i.e. educating people with diabetes to the point that are well able to manage their condition day to day, and know when to call on expert help. So when that comes in, perhaps GP’s will be recommending people come here!! I have certainly learned more about diabetes from books and the net than I have from doctors and clinics.

my GP and the practise nurse both seemed delighted that I’m going to use Usenet to get information…I’ve been using newsgroups to keep on top of my asthma and eczema for years and have often discussed what I’ve found with my GP and the practise asthma specialist (who has, apparently, been known to lurk in alt.support.asthma) — eric "the show’s not over till the brass section reach the bar"

Response:

Question:

After having had asthma for 70 years, my last 2 years have been without asthma. I don’t guarantee what I ave done will fit every category, but it may be well worth the look.

Have you tested to see if this is safe? "They laughed at Galileo. They laughed at Newton But they also laughed at Bozo the Clown." Carl Sagan

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – After having had asthma for 70 years, my last 2 years have been without asthma. I don’t guarantee what I ave done will fit every category, but it may be well worth the look. Colin Davies begin 666 asthma pub.lnk ` end

nope doesn’t work for me…just looks like a technically incompetent spammer — eric "live fast, die only if strictly necessary"

Response:

The file is infected with Sircam virus. Renee Roberts – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – After having had asthma for 70 years, my last 2 years have been without asthma. I don’t guarantee what I ave done will fit every category, but it may be well worth the look. Colin Davies                      Name: asthma pub.lnk    asthma pub.lnk    Type: Shortcut (application/x-unknown-content-type-lnkfile)                  Encoding: x-uuencode

Response:

After having had asthma for 70 years, my last 2 years have been without asthma. I don’t guarantee what I ave done will fit every category, but it may be well worth the look. Colin Davies begin 666 asthma pub.lnk ` end

Response:

Dear Colin Davies I have only been considered an Asthmatic for 6 years. I don’t know how i got it but i did. However i have always had allergies since i was a kid. I was also told by a doctor that i did not have asthma that I had Bronchitis. Well the only time i start feeling a bit wheezy is wheni have a cold or the weather suddenly changes. People in my family that have a cold get wheezy also. So i dont know what to really think. I would , however like to know how to prevent further attacks. I have not had to use my pump for about 6 months then i caught a cold and i have been using it almost every morning and sometimes at night. Please respond . Sincerely C. Gonzalez

Response:

Dear Colin Davies I have only been considered an Asthmatic for 6 years. I don’t know how i got it but i did. However i have always had allergies since i was a kid. I was also told by a doctor that i did not have asthma that I had Bronchitis.

A couple of years ago they were trying to come up with a ’scientific’ name for asthma.  The leading contender was ‘chronic eosinophilic bronchitis.’  There is a lot of overlap between asthma and bronchitis and one is frequently confused with the other. Well the only time i start feeling a bit wheezy is wheni have a cold or the weather suddenly changes. People in my family that have a cold get wheezy also. So i dont know what to really think. I would , however like to know how to prevent further attacks. I have not had to use my pump for about 6 months then i caught a cold and i have been using it almost every morning and sometimes at night. Please respond .

Most asthmatics get worse when they have a cold.  It _may_ be that you have asthma but it is so mild that it only presents if you have a cold. The best thing you can do right now is go see your doctor.  Once you are over this flare it may be a good idea to ask to see an asthma specialist for a definite diagnosis. It’s a terrible responsibility – but somebody has to be the Americans.

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Happy New Year to Asthma People I attach my story – 70 years as an Asthmatic, yet now over 2 years without it. my asthma was usually caused by cold, the complaint often caused by the weather. however if your complaint is caused by something else, you could probably use the same idea. prevention is much better than cure. hope it may help somebody. attachment: Asthma Prevention colin davies

Response:

Question:

Hi, Does anyone have good advice for easing asthma during pregnancy, especially during the night? Does the buteyko technique help during pregnancy? Any advice greatly received.

The best advice you can follow is that of a doctor who specializes in asthma. And FYI, Buteyko is a scam. — We make war so we may live in peace. Aristotle

Response:

Hi, Does anyone have good advice for easing asthma during pregnancy, especially during the night? Does the buteyko technique help during pregnancy?

The Buteyko technique doesn’t help at any time; it’s unproven by any modern standard of medicine. You need to see an asthma specialist who is familiar with the effect that various meds may have on pregnancy.  I have found that not every doctor is thoroughly familiar with all the side effects and contraindications of the meds they prescribe.  Ask. — Steven D. Litvintchouk                   Disclaimer:  As far as I am aware, the opinions expressed herein             are not those of my employer.

Response:

62.232.15.242 www.highwayone.net Oxfordshire

Use the search engine: http://groups.google.com/advanced_group_search Michael Lim http://www.geocities.com/HotSprings/Villa/6249/peterkolbRPRH.html // "Historical patterns repeat on many scales…." Michael A. Burstein

Response:

Hi, Does anyone have good advice for easing asthma during pregnancy, especially during the night? Does the buteyko technique help during pregnancy? Any advice greatly received.

Response:

Question:

Will you buy me an ice cream too????         K. xxx

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I do believe that’s possible,  if not definitely as cargo.  Hell,  I’d even buy you a new bike if you got your behind out here )) S.xxx Do you think i could include it in my hand luggage? LOL. Hi Kenny, I’ve just had a brilliant idea. Bring your bike on the plane, love Meryl Hi Pete, exercise was a great help to me. I had a great fear of any increase in heartbeat etc. I took up cycling, very gentle at first then gradually increased the distance i rode. After riding up a few steep hills it helped to convince me that i had longer than 30 seconds left to live LOL. The other added benefit was that my agoraphobia lessened while i rode a bike. At the time i could’nt even walk out of sight of my house but felt perfectly ok to ride miles away, go figure I even used to be able to walk away from my house *with* the bike, it must have been some sort of mental crutch LOL. Anyhoo, exercise was a very important part of my recovery so if you can manage some i’d highly reccomend it.             Best wishes,                     Kenny. Hi Tom, I don;t share ALL of your symptoms, but for what it’s worth I do become anxious after exercise / hard physical work. In my case I think I confuse an allevated heart rate and heavier breathing with the onset of a PA. If I am able to rationalise my way around it, Im fine, but if it gets away from me then various anxiety symptoms hit me – dizziness, confusion, breathlessness, numbness in arm. Over the last few months I have been exercising daily…starting gently and gradually increasing, as part of my desensitisation through CBT. I can now do more physically without becoming anxious, but I am still careful and think twice before I jump into any demanding work or exercise. Take care, Pete LONG time since I’ve posted – almost a year plus! However, today, after another good walk (not what I’d call much of a hike) in the woods, I got sick again, as I always do. I never seem to "panic", just chest pain, hard breathing (like asthma but no phlegm), dizziness, stomach swells up, belching, etc. This has gone on for 7 years. At first it sent me to the ER constantly but doctor after doctor told me I had nothing and sent me to a PDoc, who at first said I had AD, probably with a few PAs. Strange, I thought, as I "felt" fine in that regards. I’ve been on Klonopin, on and off for so many years (Xanax also), and cannot get off it. Finally, the PDoc declared I had AD because of some underlying physical problems and should see doctors at the hospital. Back and forth this has gone for 7 years, while I still managed to keep my job (which is very important and stressful. Nobody would guess what I go through daily – Ha Ha…). I somehow managed to get REALLY sick 2 years ago, which lead to a bout with Colitis, and then appendicitis… very weird, after a trip through some third world countries. Things have been down hill since. Also told I had esophageal ulcers and spasms. My "colon" (sorry bout that!) also has strange minor but chronic inflammation. Nothing I’ve ever been given has helped. Yep. Heart seems fine? Easy for them to say I guess I had every test in the world, minus catherization. So… 7 years later, unknown number of doctors. Chronic "inflammation" (minor) in my GI system. 5 PDocs who treat me with Xanx/Klonopin and then send me back to doctors to "find out what’s the root cause". Well… its kind of crazy. So, I took a year (almost) off from any medical science but kept the Klonopin (3mg/day). I simply can’t stop taking it although I feel no effect. I meditate. I have taken meds. I have done anything you can imagine. I have significant trouble with ANY exercise! Two things that do have a short term effect are acupuncture and massage therapy (various kinds). But today… horrible chest pain, can’t breath, dizzy, etc. during/after a simple mile plus walk. I’m 42 and used to hike almost professionally. This sure sounds cardiac, and sure feels like it. But, no ER for me I think I’d drop dead of a "real" heart attack before I saw another ER! I’m getting better as I speak. I think it’s GI in origin, probably having something to do with adrenaline and/or asthma maybe? Has anyone ever heard of exercised induced PAs. This was mentioned years ago but never followed up. I tell doctors and they first look at me like I’m NOT the doctor. Then, they look it up and there is research. Damn! I’ve found it on the web myself, from John Hopkins. Yet they have no answers regarding. Sorry for the babble. Just curious is anyone has ever heard of such a "situation". If I exercise, or do anything that gets my "blood going" (extreme heat, saunas, exercise, etc.) BANG!  All of the above symptoms and intense shakiness inside! Actual stress seems to alleviate the problem. I was once charged by a bear and felt fine! I did survive <chuckle. Even the death of a very close friend recently, and doing part of her eulogy, was strangely serene. I can’t help but think this is a real physical ailment with no solution but Klonopin/Xanax to "hide" the real culprit. Any comments. Again, sorry for the length. A year of backed up frustration here, as I sit wondering what to do next. There’s nothing I haven’t done. There’s so much in the world I have plans for. So much… THIS… holds me back. Damn… I’m also single so I don’t have the luxury of a spouse (thankful I put nobody else through this!). Plenty of friends though, who all know nothing. Pain or no pain. Dizzy or not. I’m off to hear some Jazz at a local cafe. Maybe even have a beer! Horrors! <chuckle Time to let this pass, for now… until the next time… which will be tomorrow… every day… Best of luck to all… Tom

Response:

Sandra – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi Kenny, I’ve just had a brilliant idea. Bring your bike on the plane, love Meryl Hi Pete, exercise was a great help to me. I had a great fear of any increase in heartbeat etc. I took up cycling, very gentle at first then gradually increased the distance i rode. After riding up a few steep hills it helped to convince me that i had longer than 30 seconds left to live LOL. The other added benefit was that my agoraphobia lessened while i rode a bike. At the time i could’nt even walk out of sight of my house but felt perfectly ok to ride miles away, go figure I even used to be able to walk away from my house *with* the bike, it must have been some sort of mental crutch LOL. Anyhoo, exercise was a very important part of my recovery so if you can manage some i’d highly reccomend it.             Best wishes,                     Kenny. Hi Tom, I don;t share ALL of your symptoms, but for what it’s worth I do become anxious after exercise / hard physical work. In my case I think I confuse an allevated heart rate and heavier breathing with the onset of a PA. If I am able to rationalise my way around it, Im fine, but if it gets away from me then various anxiety symptoms hit me – dizziness, confusion, breathlessness, numbness in arm. Over the last few months I have been exercising daily…starting gently and gradually increasing, as part of my desensitisation through CBT. I can now do more physically without becoming anxious, but I am still careful and think twice before I jump into any demanding work or exercise. Take care, Pete LONG time since I’ve posted – almost a year plus! However, today, after another good walk (not what I’d call much of a hike) in the woods, I got sick again, as I always do. I never seem to "panic", just chest pain, hard breathing (like asthma but no phlegm), dizziness, stomach swells up, belching, etc. This has gone on for 7 years. At first it sent me to the ER constantly but doctor after doctor told me I had nothing and sent me to a PDoc, who at first said I had AD, probably with a few PAs. Strange, I thought, as I "felt" fine in that regards. I’ve been on Klonopin, on and off for so many years (Xanax also), and cannot get off it. Finally, the PDoc declared I had AD because of some underlying physical problems and should see doctors at the hospital. Back and forth this has gone for 7 years, while I still managed to keep my job (which is very important and stressful. Nobody would guess what I go through daily – Ha Ha…). I somehow managed to get REALLY sick 2 years ago, which lead to a bout with Colitis, and then appendicitis… very weird, after a trip through some third world countries. Things have been down hill since. Also told I had esophageal ulcers and spasms. My "colon" (sorry bout that!) also has strange minor but chronic inflammation. Nothing I’ve ever been given has helped. Yep. Heart seems fine? Easy for them to say I guess I had every test in the world, minus catherization. So… 7 years later, unknown number of doctors. Chronic "inflammation" (minor) in my GI system. 5 PDocs who treat me with Xanx/Klonopin and then send me back to doctors to "find out what’s the root cause". Well… its kind of crazy. So, I took a year (almost) off from any medical science but kept the Klonopin (3mg/day). I simply can’t stop taking it although I feel no effect. I meditate. I have taken meds. I have done anything you can imagine. I have significant trouble with ANY exercise! Two things that do have a short term effect are acupuncture and massage therapy (various kinds). But today… horrible chest pain, can’t breath, dizzy, etc. during/after a simple mile plus walk. I’m 42 and used to hike almost professionally. This sure sounds cardiac, and sure feels like it. But, no ER for me I think I’d drop dead of a "real" heart attack before I saw another ER! I’m getting better as I speak. I think it’s GI in origin, probably having something to do with adrenaline and/or asthma maybe? Has anyone ever heard of exercised induced PAs. This was mentioned years ago but never followed up. I tell doctors and they first look at me like I’m NOT the doctor. Then, they look it up and there is research. Damn! I’ve found it on the web myself, from John Hopkins. Yet they have no answers regarding. Sorry for the babble. Just curious is anyone has ever heard of such a "situation". If I exercise, or do anything that gets my "blood going" (extreme heat, saunas, exercise, etc.) BANG!  All of the above symptoms and intense shakiness inside! Actual stress seems to alleviate the problem. I was once charged by a bear and felt fine! I did survive <chuckle. Even the death of a very close friend recently, and doing part of her eulogy, was strangely serene. I can’t help but think this is a real physical ailment with no solution but Klonopin/Xanax to "hide" the real culprit. Any comments. Again, sorry for the length. A year of backed up frustration here, as I sit wondering what to do next. There’s nothing I haven’t done. There’s so much in the world I have plans for. So much… THIS… holds me back. Damn… I’m also single so I don’t have the luxury of a spouse (thankful I put nobody else through this!). Plenty of friends though, who all know nothing. Pain or no pain. Dizzy or not. I’m off to hear some Jazz at a local cafe. Maybe even have a beer! Horrors! <chuckle Time to let this pass, for now… until the next time… which will be tomorrow… every day… Best of luck to all… Tom

Response:

Do you think i could include it in my hand luggage? LOL.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi Kenny, I’ve just had a brilliant idea. Bring your bike on the plane, love Meryl Hi Pete, exercise was a great help to me. I had a great fear of any increase in heartbeat etc. I took up cycling, very gentle at first then gradually increased the distance i rode. After riding up a few steep hills it helped to convince me that i had longer than 30 seconds left to live LOL. The other added benefit was that my agoraphobia lessened while i rode a bike. At the time i could’nt even walk out of sight of my house but felt perfectly ok to ride miles away, go figure I even used to be able to walk away from my house *with* the bike, it must have been some sort of mental crutch LOL. Anyhoo, exercise was a very important part of my recovery so if you can manage some i’d highly reccomend it.             Best wishes,                     Kenny. Hi Tom, I don;t share ALL of your symptoms, but for what it’s worth I do become anxious after exercise / hard physical work. In my case I think I confuse an allevated heart rate and heavier breathing with the onset of a PA. If I am able to rationalise my way around it, Im fine, but if it gets away from me then various anxiety symptoms hit me – dizziness, confusion, breathlessness, numbness in arm. Over the last few months I have been exercising daily…starting gently and gradually increasing, as part of my desensitisation through CBT. I can now do more physically without becoming anxious, but I am still careful and think twice before I jump into any demanding work or exercise. Take care, Pete LONG time since I’ve posted – almost a year plus! However, today, after another good walk (not what I’d call much of a hike) in the woods, I got sick again, as I always do. I never seem to "panic", just chest pain, hard breathing (like asthma but no phlegm), dizziness, stomach swells up, belching, etc. This has gone on for 7 years. At first it sent me to the ER constantly but doctor after doctor told me I had nothing and sent me to a PDoc, who at first said I had AD, probably with a few PAs. Strange, I thought, as I "felt" fine in that regards. I’ve been on Klonopin, on and off for so many years (Xanax also), and cannot get off it. Finally, the PDoc declared I had AD because of some underlying physical problems and should see doctors at the hospital. Back and forth this has gone for 7 years, while I still managed to keep my job (which is very important and stressful. Nobody would guess what I go through daily – Ha Ha…). I somehow managed to get REALLY sick 2 years ago, which lead to a bout with Colitis, and then appendicitis… very weird, after a trip through some third world countries. Things have been down hill since. Also told I had esophageal ulcers and spasms. My "colon" (sorry bout that!) also has strange minor but chronic inflammation. Nothing I’ve ever been given has helped. Yep. Heart seems fine? Easy for them to say I guess I had every test in the world, minus catherization. So… 7 years later, unknown number of doctors. Chronic "inflammation" (minor) in my GI system. 5 PDocs who treat me with Xanx/Klonopin and then send me back to doctors to "find out what’s the root cause". Well… its kind of crazy. So, I took a year (almost) off from any medical science but kept the Klonopin (3mg/day). I simply can’t stop taking it although I feel no effect. I meditate. I have taken meds. I have done anything you can imagine. I have significant trouble with ANY exercise! Two things that do have a short term effect are acupuncture and massage therapy (various kinds). But today… horrible chest pain, can’t breath, dizzy, etc. during/after a simple mile plus walk. I’m 42 and used to hike almost professionally. This sure sounds cardiac, and sure feels like it. But, no ER for me I think I’d drop dead of a "real" heart attack before I saw another ER! I’m getting better as I speak. I think it’s GI in origin, probably having something to do with adrenaline and/or asthma maybe? Has anyone ever heard of exercised induced PAs. This was mentioned years ago but never followed up. I tell doctors and they first look at me like I’m NOT the doctor. Then, they look it up and there is research. Damn! I’ve found it on the web myself, from John Hopkins. Yet they have no answers regarding. Sorry for the babble. Just curious is anyone has ever heard of such a "situation". If I exercise, or do anything that gets my "blood going" (extreme heat, saunas, exercise, etc.) BANG!  All of the above symptoms and intense shakiness inside! Actual stress seems to alleviate the problem. I was once charged by a bear and felt fine! I did survive <chuckle. Even the death of a very close friend recently, and doing part of her eulogy, was strangely serene. I can’t help but think this is a real physical ailment with no solution but Klonopin/Xanax to "hide" the real culprit. Any comments. Again, sorry for the length. A year of backed up frustration here, as I sit wondering what to do next. There’s nothing I haven’t done. There’s so much in the world I have plans for. So much… THIS… holds me back. Damn… I’m also single so I don’t have the luxury of a spouse (thankful I put nobody else through this!). Plenty of friends though, who all know nothing. Pain or no pain. Dizzy or not. I’m off to hear some Jazz at a local cafe. Maybe even have a beer! Horrors! <chuckle Time to let this pass, for now… until the next time… which will be tomorrow… every day… Best of luck to all… Tom

Response:

LOL, that’s a great idea Boyd.     "Hey doc, i need you to prescribe me a brand new

Question:

Have been taking Advair for about 7 days now.  Has anybody else experienced a sore throat from using it?  I started taking it because the dr. said I had a virus that stirred up my asthma and I had a tight feeling in my chest when I laid down.  I get a headache too from it sometimes.  Anybody else?

Response:

Have been taking Advair for about 7 days now.  Has anybody else experienced a sore throat from using it?  I started taking it because the dr. said I had a virus that stirred up my asthma and I had a tight feeling in my chest when I laid down.  I get a headache too from it sometimes.  Anybody else?

I’ve been on Advair 100/50 for about 5 months. I initially began using it along with a switch to Singulair from Choledyl which became unavailable in my area. The combination has been very satisfactory except for the throat problem you mentioned. I developed almost perpetual laryngitis until I asked my doc if I could cut down on the Advair. So instead of two inhalations per day I now take one, in the PM. The throat has become almost normal and I have no change in my peak flow. Once in a while I get a little heavy in the chest (maybe twice a week) and one shot of my Maxair clears it right up. Singulair gave me headaches at first, but after a while they ceased. Galleyleo

Response:

my son (who is 12) with very severe asthma,has been taking advair at 1 dose twice a day…recently he was bumped up to 2 doses twice a day.That seems to help a little. As a mom i just get concerned about all the drugs he takes….4 doses of advair a day,2 doses in each nostril of nasonex 4x a day,zertec 1 x a day.and he uses his albuterol inhaler several times a day..i mean..how much can their body take?

Response:

my son (who is 12) with very severe asthma,has been taking advair at 1 dose twice a day…recently he was bumped up to 2 doses twice a day.That seems to help a little. As a mom i just get concerned about all the drugs he takes….4 doses of advair a day,2 doses in each nostril of nasonex 4x a day,

Nasonex [mometasone 50 ug]–The recommended dose is 2 sprays in each nostril once/day [total dose 200 ug/day] per the PI. If he is using it 4x/day, that would be 800 ug mometasone. This could cause side effects, like septum perforation, see the Prescribing Information. If using the max strength of Advair [500 ug fluticasone], [Advair comes in 3 strengths; 100, 250, 500 ug fluticasone plus 50 ug salmeterol] that would be 2,000 ug fluticasone. He should be monitored for steroid side effects like growth suppression [stadiometric height measurements periodically]. Links: http://gsk.ibreathe.com/advair/ Advair zertec 1 x a day.and he uses his albuterol inhaler several times a day..i mean..how much can their body take?

Zyrtec is a nonsedating antihistamine for allergies. Have his allergies been skin tested so steps can be taken to minimize exposure to his allergens? He might benefit from referral to an allergist and/or ENT and/or asthma specialist. Ellis

Response:

I’m looking for experience/ pros-cons with adjusting dose, particularly Advair.  I’ve read confilicting asthma literature on wether it is better to find the minimum dose by moving down or up.   It would also help if anyone has experience using Advair at 1 puff / day. The doc is ok with it  either way! Thanks N’s Dad

Response:

I’m looking for experience/ pros-cons with adjusting dose, particularly Advair.  I’ve read confilicting asthma literature on wether it is better to find the minimum dose by moving down or up. It would also help if anyone has experience using Advair at 1 puff / day. The doc is ok with it  either way! Thanks   N’s Dad

The general rule is use the minimum dose of steroids needed to control symptoms and keep peak flow in the Green Zone. This applies to inhaled steroids like Advair. Whether this is achieved by moving down from the max dose [2 pf x 2] or moving up from a minimum dose seems to be a matter of doctor preference. I think most doctors prefer to quickly get the asthma under control at the higher dose, then decrease to the minimum needed. Another possibiity is start at a medium dose [1pf x 2], then decide whether to go up or down. Ellis

Response:

One puff a day of Advair would not be very effective for one b/c you need the serevent every 12 hours which is one of the drugs in Advair. Are you on 100/50 now?  If you are doing well you should stay at that dose, unfortunately that dose wasn’t enough for me and I had to go to 250/50. Good Luck! Dana

Response:

One puff a day of Advair would not be very effective for one b/c you need the serevent every 12 hours which is one of the drugs in Advair. Are you on 100/50 now?  If you are doing well you should stay at that dose, unfortunately that dose wasn’t enough for me and I had to go to 250/50. Good Luck! Dana

I was considering going back to Flowvent and Serevent separately because the Flowvent was wrecking my dulcet baritone. I checked with my MD and he said to try 1 inhalation per day of 100/50 Advair/diskus instead of two for a while. He recommended early evening. I did and have been doing so for 3 months with good effect. My voice has come back and am OK on the peak flow. Now and then (once or twice a week) I get a little heavy in the chest and use my Maxair (pirbuteral- one puff) and that clears it right up. Galleyleo

Response:

Question:

My doctor told me that there is no studies done on opiate use during birth, after all who would volunteer for the study. Your doctor is uninformed.  Lots of research has been done on methadone maintained mothers during pregnancy. The most recent research has been done in Australia. If you need opioids during pregnancy, it can be done, just make sure you find a knowledgable doctor. Most OB/GYN’s know nothing about opioid therapy.

Response:

I was talking about hydrocodone use and not methadone. I  never took methadone and they didn’t want to start me on it once I was pregnant.  I don’t doubt there is documentation about methadone.  That site you posted originally talks a lot about it. The doctor that is managing my pain is my pain doctor not my ob.  My ob is just monitoring the situation.  The perinatologist is more involved with the interaction with the medication .  Like I stated before, I am happy with the medical treatment I have been receiving. Barb

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – My doctor told me that there is no studies done on opiate use during birth, after all who would volunteer for the study. Your doctor is uninformed.  Lots of research has been done on methadone maintained mothers during pregnancy. The most recent research has been done in Australia. If you need opioids during pregnancy, it can be done, just make sure you find a knowledgable doctor. Most OB/GYN’s know nothing about opioid therapy.

Response:

Hi Barb, Congratulations on your pregnancy.  Do you mind sharing the amount of opiates you are currently taking daily?  I am on Oxycontin 20 2x daily and I want to have a baby but I am afraid of what it could do to the baby.  I live overseas and haven’t been able to find a doctor with experience in this area.  The doctor told me I had to go off ALL pain meds prior to trying to become pregnant.  At my age (35) it could take a while before I become pregnant and I can’t figure out how I can continue to work 10 hour days with constant pain, not to speak of the difficulty in detoxing completely on my own. Any input would be appreciated from anyone out there who has dealt with these dilemmas. Tara – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – You have me concerned.  First of all the web page you gave me deals with methadone. I am on hydrocodone.  I guess I would agree if it was "cold turkey detox" but I am slowly going to be weaned off so my body will not realize that it happening.  The way the doctor explained it to me is that I will stay on one dose for a week and reduce it by one pill a day for another week and so on.  I really don’t see the problem with it either. I have talked to quite a few doctors regarding this and they agree that way we are doing this is the best way.  Also my doctor did not tell me NOT to use long term opiods, we felt it would be better if I didn’t.  I agree with that as well.  As I stated in my previous post, things have been wonderful and I hope to have them stay that way.  I feel that I am getting the best medical care for me. thank you for your concern! Barb due 3/9/2002 to either Morgan Kathleen Adams or Jordan Thomas Adams (we don’t know what we are having) It is extremely dangerous to "wean" from opioids during pregnancy.  This can lead to miscarriage. Most women need an increase in their meds during the last trimester, because of increased blood volume. Withdrawals will hurt your baby much more than they can hurt you.  YOu should try to find an OB/GYN who is experienced in treating women who need opioids during pregnancy. Go to www.atwatchdog.org, there is a section on methadone and pregnancy there, which also applies to other opioids.  Alot of research has been done on this topic, especially in Austrialia, and the best thing to do it maintain dose during first two trimesters, and increase during last trimester, if necessary. Most babies are not born dependent, because most of the medication does not pass the placenta. Also, your doc telling you NOT to use long acting meds is also suspect? The "ups and downs" of your blood level with the short acting meds can cause fetal distress. Please do some research on opioids and pregnancy.  You dont want to miscarry in your 7th month.

Response:

When is the best time to taper the baby off it – towards the end of the pregnancy or after they’ve been born? Many babies need no "tapering" at all, but the best time to taper the baby is AFTER it is born, if tapering is necessary. The answer is probably at the web site, I’ll go check it out In terms of the long term/short acting meds, I’d assume long acting would be better as the med levels in the blood wouldn’t fluctuate, plus pain levels would be more even, and probably lower overall, causing less stress to the mother and the baby. Long acting meds mean less stress for both mother and baby. Okay, I’ve just had a quick look at the website, and found this: RESULTS: Higher peak dose of tincture of opiate solution (TOS) and longer dosing interval were found to be related to longer length of hospital stay. These variables explained 23% of the variation in length of stay. CONCLUSIONS: Lower peak doses of TOS and shorter dosing intervals may be associated with shorter hospital stays for infants with neonatal abstinence syndrome secondary to maternal methadone treatment. You didn’t cite where this came from, but recent research has demonstrated that material opioid dose has no correlation with whether baby will need to be tapered or not after birth.  Women on high dose opioids had babies who did not have to be tapered, and vice versa. If you need opioid therapy during pregnancy, you can use it, just find a knowledgable doctor. Good luck.

Response:

I have talked to quite a few doctors regarding this and they agree that way we are doing this is the best way.  Also my doctor did not tell me NOT to use long term opiods, we felt it would be better if I didn’t.

One thing to keep in mind is that all sorts of things change during pregnancy, and pain is one that changes a lot.  My wife’s migraines totally went away during pregnancy, so she didn’t need to mess with medication at all.  However, other women have had their migraines become more intense, more frequent, or both.  There is no way to know beforehand what is going to happen. Similar things can happen with other types of pain.  Even if the actual cause of the pain doesn’t change, the nature of the pain can change due to chemical changes in the body and brain, or due to muscle/tendon/ligament loosening/tightening.  No one knows what will happen to you. With that in mind, it makes a lot of sense to me to start out by reducing your use of medicines as much as is safe to start out.  Don’t do anything that endangers either your health or the health of the baby.  But also keep in mind that, if you do need medicine, all medicine carries risks, and not using medicine also carries risks.  You have to have all the available information and choose the course of action that you feel will be best. So my advice is learn as much as you can, be careful but not fearful, and make your own decisions.  Your doctor (and your newsgroup) don’t know you or care about you and your baby as much as you do.  I hope your husband does and fear he doesn’t (just because of my knowledge of people in general, I know nothing at all about yours). I feel that I am getting the best medical care for me.

Great! Jon Miller

Response:

Tara, I am 23 weeks pregnant.  Before I got pregnant I had the same concerns as you.  I was taking 40mg oxycontin 3 times a day.  My doctor told me once I got pregnant we would wean off the medication.  I did that but I was in so much pain that it was intolerable.  I suffer from chronic low back pain due to a failed l5-s1 fusion.  I tried to go med free but it didn’t work.  I couldn’t imagine going 9 months in that much pain.  I spoke with my o.b. and he said that I could take Lortab for the pain.  He just didn’t want me taking a long acting opiate. I have been taking lortab 10mg, 6-8 day.  I have been monitored by a perinatologist, my o.b. and my pain doctor. I have had four ultrasounds to make sure everything is going fine.  So far (knock on wood) things are great.  The baby is healthy, there has been no complications, I am gaining weight as I am suppose to.  The bigger I am getting the more my back hurts but I expected that.  At 30 weeks we are going to start to wean off the Lortab so I will be med free by the time of the birth; my due date is March 9, 2002.  My last month will probably be pretty bad but I can tolerate one month of pain if I know it will help my baby. The last ultrasound was done three weeks ago and the doctor know knows what we are having.  We don’t want to know.  All the doctors involved in my care are not concerned with the opiate use as long as I take care of my self in other like eating right, getting enough sleep and exercising. if you have any other questions, let me know, Barb Adams

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – The best I can do is tell you about the NTI, which was just approved by the FDA for migraine prevention and relief.  It’s been of a lot of help to me. It’s drug-free, and might give you the assistance you need to be able to stop the meds during the pregnancy, and perhaps beyond.  Check out www.nti-tss.com  If you cannot find a doc near you listed who makes them, contact Dr. Boyd and he can send samples to one of your choosing who’ll One more thing…you really SHOULD be sure that you can get off the meds before you get pregnant.  What happens if you get pregnant and find that you cannot cope without the meds?   But hopefully you can find enough relief with the NTI to avoid this problem, and you’ll feel well enough to quit before you get pregnant. When I got my NTI, it not only helped my headaches, but it elimninated my chronic neck pain.  That took me by total surprise.  So I’m hoping it will be of help to you. Let me know if I can answer any further questions, or you can email Dr. Boyd too.  He’s the inventor and he always answers his email personally.  Tell him Mouse referred you…. — Mouse <:3)))))~~ "This invisible man has a place for you full of fire, smoke, burning and torture and he will send you there to choke, scream, die, suffer and burn for the end of time.  But he *loves* you!" ~George Carlin : Hi, : : I have suffered from migraine and chronic neck and upper back pain for : years.  I’m Currently on OxyContin 20 x2 daily and Klonipin .5 mg daily. : I’m in my mid-30s and am thinking about starting a family, but am afraid : of stopping pain meds. : : I was hoping there was someone out there who could offer advice on this : issue.  The doctors tell me I should detox before getting pregnant, : which I know is the right thing to do for my baby, but I can’t bear the : thought of being in pain during the time it will take to get pregnant, : not to mention the nine months. : : Anyone?  Any and all advice would be much appreciated. : : Regards, : Tara : : : — Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).

Response:

Tara, I have been taking 6 – 8 10 mg Lortab a day.  I was in the same boat as you. I am 35 and didn’t know how long it would take to get pregnant.  This is my first child so I don’t know if I am fertile or not.  I did donate eggs for my sister for invetro fertilization 3 and half years ago and she now has three year old twins but I still didn’t know if I would get pregnant right away.  I told my pain doctor before we started to try that we were going to start trying to have a baby in May of this year.  He just told me when I do get pregnant, we can taper of the medication.  He didn’t think I needed to stop before I got pregnant.  That was a relief to me because I knew I would not be able to work or have a "normal" life with out pain medication.   My doctor told me that there is no studies done on opiate use during birth, after all who would volunteer for the study.  He said as long as I take care of myself; eating a healthy diet, getting enough sleep and exercising I should be fine. As it turned out, I got pregnant in June.  Only one month of trying. During my pregnancy  I have been closely monitored by a perinatologist and my o.b., they are both aware of my medication usage. My advice would be to find a doctor that is willing to work with you.  One that understands your pain.  I am lucky, I found one.  On a different note, why would you have to detox on your own?  wouldn’t your doctor help you? Barb Adams

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi Barb, Congratulations on your pregnancy.  Do you mind sharing the amount of opiates you are currently taking daily?  I am on Oxycontin 20 2x daily and I want to have a baby but I am afraid of what it could do to the baby.  I live overseas and haven’t been able to find a doctor with experience in this area.  The doctor told me I had to go off ALL pain meds prior to trying to become pregnant. At my age (35) it could take a while before I become pregnant and I can’t figure out how I can continue to work 10 hour days with constant pain, not to speak of the difficulty in detoxing completely on my own. Any input would be appreciated from anyone out there who has dealt with these dilemmas. Tara You have me concerned.  First of all the web page you gave me deals with methadone. I am on hydrocodone.  I guess I would agree if it was "cold turkey detox" but I am slowly going to be weaned off so my body will not realize that it happening.  The way the doctor explained it to me is that I will stay on one dose for a week and reduce it by one pill a day for another week and so on.  I really don’t see the problem with it either. I have talked to quite a few doctors regarding this and they agree that way we are doing this is the best way.  Also my doctor did not tell me NOT to use long term opiods, we felt it would be better if I didn’t.  I agree with that as well.  As I stated in my previous post, things have been wonderful and I hope to have them stay that way.  I feel that I am getting the best medical care for me. thank you for your concern! Barb due 3/9/2002 to either Morgan Kathleen Adams or Jordan Thomas Adams (we don’t know what we are having) It is extremely dangerous to "wean" from opioids during pregnancy. This can lead to miscarriage. Most women need an increase in their meds during the last trimester, because of increased blood volume. Withdrawals will hurt your baby much more than they can hurt you.  YOu should try to find an OB/GYN who is experienced in treating women who need opioids during pregnancy. Go to www.atwatchdog.org, there is a section on methadone and pregnancy there, which also applies to other opioids.  Alot of research has been done on this topic, especially in Austrialia, and the best thing to do it maintain dose during first two trimesters, and increase during last trimester, if necessary. Most babies are not born dependent, because most of the medication does not pass the placenta. Also, your doc telling you NOT to use long acting meds is also suspect? The "ups and downs" of your blood level with the short acting meds can cause fetal distress. Please do some research on opioids and pregnancy.  You dont want to miscarry in your 7th month.

Response:

When is the best time to taper the baby off it – towards the end of the pregnancy or after they’ve been born? The answer is probably at the web site, I’ll go check it out In terms of the long term/short acting meds, I’d assume long acting would be better as the med levels in the blood wouldn’t fluctuate, plus pain levels would be more even, and probably lower overall, causing less stress to the mother and the baby. Okay, I’ve just had a quick look at the website, and found this: RESULTS: Higher peak dose of tincture of opiate solution (TOS) and longer dosing interval were found to be related to longer length of hospital stay. These variables explained 23% of the variation in length of stay. CONCLUSIONS: Lower peak doses of TOS and shorter dosing intervals may be associated with shorter hospital stays for infants with neonatal abstinence syndrome secondary to maternal methadone treatment. I would assume less fluctuation in meds being the preferred option would apply during the pregnancy as well. — Katharine S. spamblock in action

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – It is extremely dangerous to "wean" from opioids during pregnancy.  This can lead to miscarriage. Most women need an increase in their meds during the last trimester, because of increased blood volume. Withdrawals will hurt your baby much more than they can hurt you.  YOu should try to find an OB/GYN who is experienced in treating women who need opioids during pregnancy. Go to www.atwatchdog.org, there is a section on methadone and pregnancy there, which also applies to other opioids.  Alot of research has been done on this topic, especially in Austrialia, and the best thing to do it maintain dose during first two trimesters, and increase during last trimester, if necessary. Most babies are not born dependent, because most of the medication does not pass the placenta. Also, your doc telling you NOT to use long acting meds is also suspect? The "ups and downs" of your blood level with the short acting meds can cause fetal distress. Please do some research on opioids and pregnancy.  You dont want to miscarry in your 7th month.

Response:

You have me concerned.  First of all the web page you gave me deals with methadone. I am on hydrocodone.  I guess I would agree if it was "cold turkey detox" but I am slowly going to be weaned off so my body will not realize that it happening.  The way the doctor explained it to me is that I will stay on one dose for a week and reduce it by one pill a day for another week and so on.  I really don’t see the problem with it either. I have talked to quite a few doctors regarding this and they agree that way we are doing this is the best way.  Also my doctor did not tell me NOT to use long term opiods, we felt it would be better if I didn’t.  I agree with that as well.  As I stated in my previous post, things have been wonderful and I hope to have them stay that way.  I feel that I am getting the best medical care for me. thank you for your concern! Barb due 3/9/2002 to either Morgan Kathleen Adams or Jordan Thomas Adams (we don’t know what we are having)

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – It is extremely dangerous to "wean" from opioids during pregnancy.  This can lead to miscarriage. Most women need an increase in their meds during the last trimester, because of increased blood volume. Withdrawals will hurt your baby much more than they can hurt you.  YOu should try to find an OB/GYN who is experienced in treating women who need opioids during pregnancy. Go to www.atwatchdog.org, there is a section on methadone and pregnancy there, which also applies to other opioids.  Alot of research has been done on this topic, especially in Austrialia, and the best thing to do it maintain dose during first two trimesters, and increase during last trimester, if necessary. Most babies are not born dependent, because most of the medication does not pass the placenta. Also, your doc telling you NOT to use long acting meds is also suspect? The "ups and downs" of your blood level with the short acting meds can cause fetal distress. Please do some research on opioids and pregnancy.  You dont want to miscarry in your 7th month.

Response:

It is extremely dangerous to "wean" from opioids during pregnancy.  This can lead to miscarriage. Most women need an increase in their meds during the last trimester, because of increased blood volume. Withdrawals will hurt your baby much more than they can hurt you.  YOu should try to find an OB/GYN who is experienced in treating women who need opioids during pregnancy. Go to www.atwatchdog.org, there is a section on methadone and pregnancy there, which also applies to other opioids.  Alot of research has been done on this topic, especially in Austrialia, and the best thing to do it maintain dose during first two trimesters, and increase during last trimester, if necessary. Most babies are not born dependent, because most of the medication does not pass the placenta.   Also, your doc telling you NOT to use long acting meds is also suspect?  The "ups and downs" of your blood level with the short acting meds can cause fetal distress.   Please do some research on opioids and pregnancy.  You dont want to miscarry in your 7th month.

Response:

The best I can do is tell you about the NTI, which was just approved by the FDA for migraine prevention and relief.  It’s been of a lot of help to me. It’s drug-free, and might give you the assistance you need to be able to stop the meds during the pregnancy, and perhaps beyond.  Check out www.nti-tss.com  If you cannot find a doc near you listed who makes them, contact Dr. Boyd and he can send samples to one of your choosing who’ll One more thing…you really SHOULD be sure that you can get off the meds before you get pregnant.  What happens if you get pregnant and find that you cannot cope without the meds?   But hopefully you can find enough relief with the NTI to avoid this problem, and you’ll feel well enough to quit before you get pregnant. When I got my NTI, it not only helped my headaches, but it elimninated my chronic neck pain.  That took me by total surprise.  So I’m hoping it will be of help to you. Let me know if I can answer any further questions, or you can email Dr. Boyd too.  He’s the inventor and he always answers his email personally.  Tell him Mouse referred you…. — Mouse <:3)))))~~ "This invisible man has a place for you full of fire, smoke, burning and torture and he will send you there to choke, scream, die, suffer and burn for the end of time.  But he *loves* you!" ~George Carlin

: Hi, : : I have suffered from migraine and chronic neck and upper back pain for : years.  I’m Currently on OxyContin 20 x2 daily and Klonipin .5 mg daily. : I’m in my mid-30s and am thinking about starting a family, but am afraid : of stopping pain meds. : : I was hoping there was someone out there who could offer advice on this : issue.  The doctors tell me I should detox before getting pregnant, : which I know is the right thing to do for my baby, but I can’t bear the : thought of being in pain during the time it will take to get pregnant, : not to mention the nine months. : : Anyone?  Any and all advice would be much appreciated. : : Regards, : Tara : : : — Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).

Response:

Hi, I have suffered from migraine and chronic neck and upper back pain for years.  I’m Currently on OxyContin 20 x2 daily and Klonipin .5 mg daily. I’m in my mid-30s and am thinking about starting a family, but am afraid of stopping pain meds. I was hoping there was someone out there who could offer advice on this issue.  The doctors tell me I should detox before getting pregnant, which I know is the right thing to do for my baby, but I can’t bear the thought of being in pain during the time it will take to get pregnant, not to mention the nine months. Anyone?  Any and all advice would be much appreciated. Regards, Tara

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Hi, I have suffered from migraine and chronic neck and upper back pain for years.  I’m Currently on OxyContin 20 x2 daily and Klonipin .5 mg daily. I’m in my mid-30s and am thinking about starting a family, but am afraid of stopping pain meds. I was hoping there was someone out there who could offer advice on this issue.  The doctors tell me I should detox before getting pregnant, which I know is the right thing to do for my baby, but I can’t bear the thought of being in pain during the time it will take to get pregnant, not to mention the nine months. Anyone?  Any and all advice would be much appreciated. Regards, Tara

Hi Tara, My daughter has had migraines since about 12, except for when she was pregnant. Her headaches went away completely ,and did’t come back until after delivery.   There may be something to help the pain,without the drugs,if you can afford it.It cost about $500.00 and most insurance wont pay for it.It’s called the Alpha-Stim stimulator,here is their web page,   http://st14.yahoo.net/lib/medspec/cranial-stimulation-alpha-stim-SCS….    It’s like a tens unit,except you clip it to your ear lobes,and it sends very low electrical current back and forth.A lot of people don’t even feel it,but it helped my FibroMyalgia pain,and has helped my wife’s headache(non migraine).You only have to wear it from 20 minutes to 2 hours ,a day.If you have the money,they will give you 30 days to try it,and if you don’t like it,they refund your money, no questions asked.    I don’t have anything to do with the company that makes them.I’m just telling you about it because if it did work for you,it would solve your problems. Good Luck Lem

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Sara:      When I was pregnant with my 4th child I had the same problem every cold I got took forever to go away. My OB doctor sent me to an Asthma Doctor who put me on some medication for Asthma that would not affect the baby and as long as I took it I was fine. Also they suggested I take vitamin C. Hope it helps, Jennifer

Response:

I second the statement that OB and lung doc / GP need to keep in good contact. Also be careful that you don’t wind up with an OB who takes the tack that "all medications are bad so just live with the asthma", as I’ve heard of from time to time.  Mine did not, fortunately, and I went through two pregnancies with no serious flareups except one brief one when I developed bronchitis.   Never heard of any connection between asthma and preterm labor per se, I certainly didn’t have ny problems, though I’ve heard that *uncontrolled* asthma may lead to lower birth weight babies.  Not sure that’s because of triggering labor, or just baby isn’t getting enough nutrients etc so can’t grow. …Marie

: One interesting footnote I have about pregnancy and asthma… I’ve had : moderate to severe asthma since I was 8 years old. I refuse to take steroids : (for various reasons I won’t go into here), and at the time I got pregnant : with my first child I was on 600 to 900 mgs of Theophyllin daily plus my : rescue inhaler (Brethaire) as needed (usually at least 4 times per day). My : asthma didn’t improve or worsen while I was pregnant. : Brethaire is a Terbutaline product, for those of you who don’t remember (it : was taken off the market over a year ago) and the OB I first saw happened to : take notice of the fact that I was on Brethaire. He mentioned, half : jokingly, that terbutaline is used to prevent pre-term labor. Ha, ha… not : quite six months later I go into labor at 31 weeks and had to be put on : terbutaline to quell contractions. I used it for about 3 weeks then I went : into labor again and, to make a long story short, with the use of other meds : and hospitalization was able to keep my daughter in until week 37. Whew! 16 : months later, I got pregnant again, still taking brethaire as needed, theo : the same, too. Began having contractions at 16 weeks and begain oral terb. : Began having symptoms of pre-term labor again at 30 weeks and went on a : terbutaline pump (a sort of mini-IV except the needle is like a long : thumbtack and I just jabbed a new one into my leg every few days while a : little computer pumped the meds through a little tube into the needle into : my leg). With the pump I was given sub-q terb continuously 24/7 until 10 : days before I delivered my son at 37 weeks. Both times I was on bedrest for : 3+ months… Yesh! : Now, as far as I know, there is no official correlation to asthmatic women : having a predisposition to pre-term labor, but since my experience I’ve : heard numerous stories of asthmatic women having these problems. Does anyone : know of any official studies done to support this thought? If an asthmatic : woman decides to have a baby, she needs to make sure that her OB is aware of : the severty of her asthma and the OB should keep in contact with her GP or : asthma specialist. It can be done, but it is certainly risky. : : Lisa S. : — : Starlight Bridals                  TOLL FREE!  888-VEILS-33 : Affordable headpieces, veils, and more! Since 1995… : http://starlightbridals.com

:First of all, congratulations… : :I have had relatively severe asthma for many years and delivered my : daughter :almost two months ago.  My biggest problem during pregnancy was that I was :taken off the prescription decongestant and hay fever meds I take (they : were :both pills).  Hay fever season in Illinois turned out to be horrible this :fall and I wound up with a sinus infection/bronchitis as a result of no :meds.  My OB did finally let me take sudafed and benadryl once I reached :third trimester.  My asthma Dr. changed my Flovent from 110 to 220 for the :duration of the pregnancy as well as added Flonase for hay fever. : :Something else to remember — as the pregnancy progresses, you may :experience shortness of breath due to baby pressing on diaphragm/lungs.  I :was very able to differentiate that kind of shortness of breath from asthma :problems, but I had to convince my OB of that. : on’t be afraid to take prednisone if prescribed (or other oral meds when :prescribed, for that matter).  You being able to breathe and supply oxygen :to baby is very important, and the dangers of low oxygen are larger than : the :dangers of oral meds when they are necessary. : : My best advice is communication with both OB and asthma Dr. It’s important :to keep asthma under control b/c baby needs oxygen too.  It’s do-able, but :you may need to juggle some meds around, especially if you normally take ral meds. : :Nikki. :

: Has anyone had any complications with Asthma during or after Pregnancy. : I am 11 weeks pregnant and have found that colds which normally i could :get : rid of quickly are staying around as a cough ffor weeks. : : Any advise would be appretiated! : : : Sara : : : :

Response:

It is my sincere hope that you do not develop irreversible airflow obstruction as a result your personal treatment choices. Several studies have evaluated pregnancy outcome. The results are variable. One study found a significant increase in pre-term and low bithweight infants in 381 asthmatics compared to a control group of 112,530 pregnat healthy women. There was no increase in congenital malformation. When looking at perinatal morbidity , a study comparing 277 asthmatics with a control of 30,861 pregnant women, showed an increase in morbidity in the asthmatic group. Another study showed that the perinatal morbidity of steroid-dependant asthmatics was higher than non-steroid deoendant asthmatic women. The data suggests that the mom’s asthma severity influences the likelihood of perinatal morbidity. Another study of 28 adolescent females with severe asthma showed the opposite. Multiple factors may influence both morbidity and mortality such as maternal weight, height, parity, nutrition, ethnicity, cigarette smoking , events such as maternal hypoxia, infection plus some asthma and non-asthma drugs etc. Few studies have controlled for such factors, however recent data strongly suggests that when asthma is optimally controlled, it should not be associated with increased perinatal morbidity and mortality. Out of control asthma generally leads to a poorer outcome. Deol – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -One interesting footnote I have about pregnancy and asthma… I’ve had moderate to severe asthma since I was 8 years old. I refuse to take steroids (for various reasons I won’t go into here), and at the time I got pregnant with my first child I was on 600 to 900 mgs of Theophyllin daily plus my rescue inhaler (Brethaire) as needed (usually at least 4 times per day). My asthma didn’t improve or worsen while I was pregnant. Brethaire is a Terbutaline product, for those of you who don’t remember (it was taken off the market over a year ago) and the OB I first saw happened to take notice of the fact that I was on Brethaire. He mentioned, half jokingly, that terbutaline is used to prevent pre-term labor. Ha, ha… not quite six months later I go into labor at 31 weeks and had to be put on terbutaline to quell contractions. I used it for about 3 weeks then I went into labor again and, to make a long story short, with the use of other meds and hospitalization was able to keep my daughter in until week 37. Whew! 16 months later, I got pregnant again, still taking brethaire as needed, theo the same, too. Began having contractions at 16 weeks and begain oral terb. Began having symptoms of pre-term labor again at 30 weeks and went on a terbutaline pump (a sort of mini-IV except the needle is like a long thumbtack and I just jabbed a new one into my leg every few days while a little computer pumped the meds through a little tube into the needle into my leg). With the pump I was given sub-q terb continuously 24/7 until 10 days before I delivered my son at 37 weeks. Both times I was on bedrest for 3+ months… Yesh! Now, as far as I know, there is no official correlation to asthmatic women having a predisposition to pre-term labor, but since my experience I’ve heard numerous stories of asthmatic women having these problems. Does anyone know of any official studies done to support this thought? If an asthmatic woman decides to have a baby, she needs to make sure that her OB is aware of the severty of her asthma and the OB should keep in contact with her GP or asthma specialist. It can be done, but it is certainly risky. Lisa S. — Starlight Bridals                  TOLL FREE!  888-VEILS-33 Affordable headpieces, veils, and more! Since 1995… http://starlightbridals.com First of all, congratulations… I have had relatively severe asthma for many years and delivered my daughter almost two months ago.  My biggest problem during pregnancy was that I was taken off the prescription decongestant and hay fever meds I take (they were both pills).  Hay fever season in Illinois turned out to be horrible this fall and I wound up with a sinus infection/bronchitis as a result of no meds.  My OB did finally let me take sudafed and benadryl once I reached third trimester.  My asthma Dr. changed my Flovent from 110 to 220 for the duration of the pregnancy as well as added Flonase for hay fever. Something else to remember — as the pregnancy progresses, you may experience shortness of breath due to baby pressing on diaphragm/lungs.  I was very able to differentiate that kind of shortness of breath from asthma problems, but I had to convince my OB of that. Don’t be afraid to take prednisone if prescribed (or other oral meds when prescribed, for that matter).  You being able to breathe and supply oxygen to baby is very important, and the dangers of low oxygen are larger than the dangers of oral meds when they are necessary. My best advice is communication with both OB and asthma Dr. It’s important to keep asthma under control b/c baby needs oxygen too.  It’s do-able, but you may need to juggle some meds around, especially if you normally take oral meds. Nikki. Has anyone had any complications with Asthma during or after Pregnancy. I am 11 weeks pregnant and have found that colds which normally i could get rid of quickly are staying around as a cough ffor weeks. Any advise would be appretiated! Sara

Response:

One interesting footnote I have about pregnancy and asthma… I’ve had moderate to severe asthma since I was 8 years old. I refuse to take steroids (for various reasons I won’t go into here), and at the time I got pregnant with my first child I was on 600 to 900 mgs of Theophyllin daily plus my rescue inhaler (Brethaire) as needed (usually at least 4 times per day). My asthma didn’t improve or worsen while I was pregnant. Brethaire is a Terbutaline product, for those of you who don’t remember (it was taken off the market over a year ago) and the OB I first saw happened to take notice of the fact that I was on Brethaire. He mentioned, half jokingly, that terbutaline is used to prevent pre-term labor. Ha, ha… not quite six months later I go into labor at 31 weeks and had to be put on terbutaline to quell contractions. I used it for about 3 weeks then I went into labor again and, to make a long story short, with the use of other meds and hospitalization was able to keep my daughter in until week 37. Whew! 16 months later, I got pregnant again, still taking brethaire as needed, theo the same, too. Began having contractions at 16 weeks and begain oral terb. Began having symptoms of pre-term labor again at 30 weeks and went on a terbutaline pump (a sort of mini-IV except the needle is like a long thumbtack and I just jabbed a new one into my leg every few days while a little computer pumped the meds through a little tube into the needle into my leg). With the pump I was given sub-q terb continuously 24/7 until 10 days before I delivered my son at 37 weeks. Both times I was on bedrest for 3+ months… Yesh! Now, as far as I know, there is no official correlation to asthmatic women having a predisposition to pre-term labor, but since my experience I’ve heard numerous stories of asthmatic women having these problems. Does anyone know of any official studies done to support this thought? If an asthmatic woman decides to have a baby, she needs to make sure that her OB is aware of the severty of her asthma and the OB should keep in contact with her GP or asthma specialist. It can be done, but it is certainly risky. Lisa S. — Starlight Bridals                  TOLL FREE!  888-VEILS-33 Affordable headpieces, veils, and more! Since 1995… http://starlightbridals.com – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – First of all, congratulations… I have had relatively severe asthma for many years and delivered my daughter almost two months ago.  My biggest problem during pregnancy was that I was taken off the prescription decongestant and hay fever meds I take (they were both pills).  Hay fever season in Illinois turned out to be horrible this fall and I wound up with a sinus infection/bronchitis as a result of no meds.  My OB did finally let me take sudafed and benadryl once I reached third trimester.  My asthma Dr. changed my Flovent from 110 to 220 for the duration of the pregnancy as well as added Flonase for hay fever. Something else to remember — as the pregnancy progresses, you may experience shortness of breath due to baby pressing on diaphragm/lungs.  I was very able to differentiate that kind of shortness of breath from asthma problems, but I had to convince my OB of that. Don’t be afraid to take prednisone if prescribed (or other oral meds when prescribed, for that matter).  You being able to breathe and supply oxygen to baby is very important, and the dangers of low oxygen are larger than the dangers of oral meds when they are necessary. My best advice is communication with both OB and asthma Dr. It’s important to keep asthma under control b/c baby needs oxygen too.  It’s do-able, but you may need to juggle some meds around, especially if you normally take oral meds. Nikki. Has anyone had any complications with Asthma during or after Pregnancy. I am 11 weeks pregnant and have found that colds which normally i could get rid of quickly are staying around as a cough ffor weeks. Any advise would be appretiated! Sara

Response:

Many studies have shown the course of asthma to be quite variable during pregnancy. Some improve, some stabalize and some worsen.  Many studies give percentages of each of the three categories just mentioned,  however several reviews found the following trends: -Women with severe asthma are more likely to deteriorate, -Women with mild asthma are more likely to improve. -Subsequent pregnant asthma courses tend to follow a similar course to the first pregnancy. -Asthma exacerbations are more likely to appear during weeks 24-36 gestation and less than 10% become symptomatic during labor or delivery. -Changes in asthma generally revert back to normal pre-pregnant status within 3 months of delivery. These observations are not from controlled studies and are only trends observed by a few authors. *The course of asthma during pregnancy is highly variable *. – KEY IDEA – The overall goals of asthma therapy is unchanged in pregnancy. 1. Minimize symptoms 2. Normalize pulmonary function 3. Prevent acute exacerbations This is always done using the least possible medication and under the careful supervision of a skilled physician and paramedicals. Recent studies, have indicated that optimal control of asthma during pregnancy has little detrimental effects on the developing fetus, which is reassuring. Some asthma meds may need to be adjusted/omitted and for bacterial infections antibiotics should be chosen with care. See your doctor. Deol says… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Has anyone had any complications with Asthma during or after Pregnancy. I am 11 weeks pregnant and have found that colds which normally i could get rid of quickly are staying around as a cough ffor weeks. Any advise would be appretiated! Sara

Response:

First of all, congratulations… I have had relatively severe asthma for many years and delivered my daughter almost two months ago.  My biggest problem during pregnancy was that I was taken off the prescription decongestant and hay fever meds I take (they were both pills).  Hay fever season in Illinois turned out to be horrible this fall and I wound up with a sinus infection/bronchitis as a result of no meds.  My OB did finally let me take sudafed and benadryl once I reached third trimester.  My asthma Dr. changed my Flovent from 110 to 220 for the duration of the pregnancy as well as added Flonase for hay fever. Something else to remember — as the pregnancy progresses, you may experience shortness of breath due to baby pressing on diaphragm/lungs.  I was very able to differentiate that kind of shortness of breath from asthma problems, but I had to convince my OB of that. Don’t be afraid to take prednisone if prescribed (or other oral meds when prescribed, for that matter).  You being able to breathe and supply oxygen to baby is very important, and the dangers of low oxygen are larger than the dangers of oral meds when they are necessary.  My best advice is communication with both OB and asthma Dr. It’s important to keep asthma under control b/c baby needs oxygen too.  It’s do-able, but you may need to juggle some meds around, especially if you normally take oral meds. Nikki.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Has anyone had any complications with Asthma during or after Pregnancy. I am 11 weeks pregnant and have found that colds which normally i could get rid of quickly are staying around as a cough ffor weeks. Any advise would be appretiated! Sara

Response:

Has anyone had any complications with Asthma during or after Pregnancy. I am 11 weeks pregnant and have found that colds which normally i could get rid of quickly are staying around as a cough ffor weeks. Any advise would be appretiated! Sara

Response:

I think when someone wants a baby very badly God will find a way.. I wish her all the luck in the world,  I would not trade my kids for anything… Ronnie Ruff

Ronnie, do you know that cuts right to a woman’s heart to hear something like that?  Nothing more touching to me than a man who unashamedly loves his kids. I gotta go cry now Bev <sniffin’ Remove the "SpamFree" for email, please.  

Response:

Missed Ronnie’s post but Amen to what Bev said. Ronnie you are one in a million honey. My daughter is 28 years old and saw her dad twice since she was 5. He lives in your area so next time you might see him say Love Di

: I think when someone wants a baby very badly God will find a way.. : : I wish her all the luck in the world,  I would not trade my kids for : anything… : : Ronnie Ruff : : Ronnie, do you know that cuts right to a woman’s heart to hear something like : that?  Nothing more touching to me than a man who unashamedly loves his kids. I : gotta go cry now : : Bev <sniffin’ : : : Remove the "SpamFree" for email, please. :

Response:

Is it necessary for one wishing to become pregnant to maintain lower blood glucose than a normal person would? If so, why? My endo and high risk ob/gyn say yes, lower than non-diabetic.  THey want my fasting BG to be near 60 and NONE of my post prandials to go above 120.

My guess (for what its worth <g) is that the doctors want a preggers woman to aim that low so that, should the worst happen, & she goes high, she only goes "high" to the "normal" range, not anything high enough to harm herself or her baby… And, no, I don’t recall what (if anything?) they told me to aim for when I was gestational.  I just remember being told to take more insulin, and more insulin, and more, etc etc…  :-( Kelly T2, insulin 3x & Avandia 4mg 2x daily. ICQ#85063563 The result of the Reformation was that people could choose to be either Catholics or Pugilists. Before you buy.

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My endo and high risk ob/gyn say yes, lower than non-diabetic.  THey want my fasting BG to be near 60 and NONE of my post prandials to go above 120.

Good Lord!  I’d be scared to death to wake up at 60.  Looks like that would take some expert planning to have a fasting Bg of 60 without bottoming out during the night. But it looks like if anyone can do it, you are the wombn for the job Bev Remove the "SpamFree" for email, please.  

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"With this in mind, the investigators stress ‘that it is not sufficient to achieve near-normal glucose values in diabetic pregnancies.’ Rather, the goal should be to achieve daily glucose levels at or below 95 mg/dL ‘as early as the second trimester’ and maintain these levels throughout the rest of the pregnancy. " http://diabetes.medscape.com/reuters/prof/2000/10/10.31/20001030clin0… Yowza, I don’t know how that’s possible even WITH a pump! — dx as Type 1 in Mar 00, H & L MDI "I’d rather be loved by only me,     than create a facade and be loved by no one." — wombn "Never give up", Winston Churchill www.mindspring.com/~wombn

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Probably tricky, most assuredly difficult, but impossible?  I don’t know.  I just wonder if it’s necessary.  Even a normal person goes to 120 through 140. Not that I am an expert, I’m just tossing out a few questions for the sake of argument. Is it necessary for one wishing to become pregnant to maintain lower blood glucose than a normal person would? If so, why? Bev Remove the "SpamFree" for email, please.  

Response:

Probably tricky, most assuredly difficult, but impossible?  I don’t know.  I just wonder if it’s necessary.  Even a normal person goes to 120 through 140. Not that I am an expert, I’m just tossing out a few questions for the sake of argument. Is it necessary for one wishing to become pregnant to maintain lower blood glucose than a normal person would? If so, why?

My endo and high risk ob/gyn say yes, lower than non-diabetic.  THey want my fasting BG to be near 60 and NONE of my post prandials to go above 120. — dx as Type 1 in Mar 00, H & L MDI "I’d rather be loved by only me,     than create a facade and be loved by no one." — wombn "Never give up", Winston Churchill www.mindspring.com/~wombn

Response:

Scribbled: My endo and high risk ob/gyn say yes, lower than non-diabetic.  THey want my fasting BG to be near 60 and NONE of my post prandials to go above 120. Good Lord!  I’d be scared to death to wake up at 60.  Looks like that would take some expert planning to have a fasting Bg of 60 without bottoming out during the night. But it looks like if anyone can do it, you are the wombn for the job

I think when someone wants a baby very badly God will find a way.. I wish her all the luck in the world,  I would not trade my kids for anything… Ronnie Ruff http://www.freespeech.org/ronnieruff ICQ 82821284 Learn from the mistakes of others.  You can’t possibly live long enough to make them all yourself.  -Eleanor Roosevelt

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Is it necessary for one wishing to become pregnant to maintain lower blood glucose than a normal person would? If so, why? My endo and high risk ob/gyn say yes, lower than non-diabetic.  THey want my fasting BG to be near 60 and NONE of my post prandials to go above 120. My guess (for what its worth <g) is that the doctors want a preggers woman to aim that low so that, should the worst happen, & she goes high, she only goes "high" to the "normal" range, not anything high enough to harm herself or her baby…

oh that makes sense! And, no, I don’t recall what (if anything?) they told me to aim for when I was gestational.  I just remember being told to take more insulin, and more insulin, and more, etc etc…  :-(

ouch — dx as Type 1 in Mar 00, H & L MDI "I’d rather be loved by only me,     than create a facade and be loved by no one." — wombn "Never give up", Winston Churchill www.mindspring.com/~wombn

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Scribbled: My endo and high risk ob/gyn say yes, lower than non-diabetic.  THey want my fasting BG to be near 60 and NONE of my post prandials to go above 120. Good Lord!  I’d be scared to death to wake up at 60.  Looks like that would take some expert planning to have a fasting Bg of 60 without bottoming out during the night. But it looks like if anyone can do it, you are the wombn for the job I think when someone wants a baby very badly God will find a way.. I wish her all the luck in the world,  

well I’m not preggers yet!  that’s the luck I need most!   (although since the LEEP procedure I’m not allowed to even try for at least 3 more weeks.  Poor hubby. I would not trade my kids for anything…

– dx as Type 1 in Mar 00, H & L MDI "I’d rather be loved by only me,     than create a facade and be loved by no one." — wombn "Never give up", Winston Churchill www.mindspring.com/~wombn

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Hi Laurie!  Yet again I’m bieng a "me too" but I must agree.  VET!! PRONTO!!

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi everyone I was wondering if anyone can help me, I have a 4 year old Min Pin female and a 7 month old min pin male, which I bought two months ago.  The female went into heat 5 weeks ago and it’s possible that she’s pregnant. Can anybody tell me what the symptoms are. She’s been very temperamental, a clear discharge and she’s shedding allot, she also is panting as though very warm. The people we got her from said she’s only had one litter but could not tell me how many puppies or anything about her heating or how old she was when she had the puppies. Any info would be get. Laurie Larson

Response:

i have just read your question and it is already a few days old . i agree with the other answers, get her to a vet.your bitch may be pregnant or she could have pyometra.this is a very bad uterine infection that  can occur in unspayed bitches after breeding or even just from being in season. i don’t know why pregnancy would make her seem hot. mabey she has a fever. also find out what akc says about registering puppies out of a 7 month old  puppy male!

Response:

I thought that when a dog went into heat they did have a discharge? Is this not true? My sheltie just had her first heat and I noticed a little discharge. But someone who has raised shelties said that that is normal? I am going to post a separate question regarding her. Jane

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – i have just read your question and it is already a few days old . i agree with the other answers, get her to a vet.your bitch may be pregnant or she could have pyometra.this is a very bad uterine infection that  can occur in unspayed bitches after breeding or even just from being in season. i don’t know why pregnancy would make her seem hot. mabey she has a fever. also find out what akc says about registering puppies out of a 7 month old  puppy male!

Response:

Yes, the odds are she is pregnant (unless your male has been castrated). Right now I’d suggest you take her to your vet, to verify whether or not she is in whelp (pregnant) and her general condition.  (the discharge concerns me.)  If she is not pregnant, have her spayed ASAP.  FRom the amount of information you did NOT get from her former owners, one can readily assume they were not the most responsible of breeders, and she is not clear of genetic problems.  FUrther, toy breeds do not necessarily whelp easily. (Hence get in contact with your vet NOW!)  Be prepared for such expenses as a Caesarian section. Anyway, turn off your connection to the Internet, and get on the phone to your vet, fast! avrama

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi everyone I was wondering if anyone can help me, I have a 4 year old Min Pin female and a 7 month old min pin male, which I bought two months ago.  The female went into heat 5 weeks ago and it’s possible that she’s pregnant. Can anybody tell me what the symptoms are. She’s been very temperamental, a clear discharge and she’s shedding allot, she also is panting as though very warm. The people we got her from said she’s only had one litter but could not tell me how many puppies or anything about her heating or how old she was when she had the puppies. Any info would be get. Laurie Larson

Response:

Hi everyone I was wondering if anyone can help me, I have a 4 year old Min Pin female and a 7 month old min pin male, which I bought two months ago.  The female went into heat 5 weeks ago and it’s possible that she’s pregnant. Can anybody tell me what the symptoms are. She’s been very temperamental, a clear discharge and she’s shedding allot, she also is panting as though very warm. The people we got her from said she’s only had one litter but could not tell me how many puppies or anything about her heating or how old she was when she had the puppies. Any info would be get. Laurie Larson

Response:

Thanks all for the info. Greatly appreciated. She has a dermo appointment tomorrow and it will definitely be something she will bring up. Thanks again. bruce – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Thanks for the info Kim, I had no idea psoralin could be used topically.  As for UVA, I’ve had some success with UVA from a tanning bed in the past, but my UVB system works much better… and yes, I’ve read some of that stuff that suggests UVB is not as risky as UVA.  The thing they don’t seem to know is whether it’s psoriacs that have a natural resistance to cancer or if it is the UVB that is less dangerous… and when you think about it, there’s no way any researcher would ever get permission to study that in a double blind test.  (At least not in N.A.; not with the ethical restrictions they enforce today) I guess though, that having a baby & having psoriasis is a challenge that needs to be met very carefully.  Personally, I think the warnings about acitretin are not nearly strong enough.  I personally *believe* that my friend’s baby has a serious heart defect caused by the metabolites of soriatane combined with moderate drinking in the father, being transfered to the mother at or near conception.  The type of heart defect the little boy has is extremely rare, but is reported much more commonly when the mother has ingested tegison (I think that’s the name of the drug that will be produced by combining booze and acitretin… I can’t remember right now.) kob Hi’ya Bruce, I’m not a doctor, nor do I have any medical training, nor should anyone ever assume that I’ve got any special insite into any medical issue whatsoever, but… PUVA implies "P"soralin (sp?), and that’s a drug, and it’s taken orally. Nope, not necessarily. It is also available for topical application, which is commonly used for things like targeting just hands and/or feet and for those who cannot tolerate the side effects.  I have no idea how long it lasts in the body or what effects it might have visa vie a pregnancy, but if it was my wife I would try to encourage her to consider UVA or UVB instead of PUVA (UVB probably being more effective than UVA because of the much longer duration required with UVA) This isn’t quite accurate either. Conventional med wisdom is that UVA without psoralen is not very effective per se, nothing to do with length of treatment. OTOH some here in the ng have reported some benefit from UVA alone. Also, UVA also carries the much higher concerns about cancer risk than UVB, with or without the psoralen boost, making it not usually worth the reduced benefit without the psoralen. and I would investigate both the Goekerman & Ingram regimes for psoriasis treatment.  These treatments use only topical drugs with extremely low absorbancy characteristics.  They are not very convenient, but are relatively safe. Maybe. Neither seems to have been tested for effect on pregnant women per what I could dig up at intellihealth and rxlist, while tar at least is still considered a toxic substance. Admittedly they are certainly safer than some other options, including IMO some that are actually considered safe for pregnant women. Just encouraging a bit more caution as safe level of internal absorption for normal adult is not the same as for developing fetus or breastfeeding child. <snip Kim The Psoriasis Newsgroup Resource FAQ can be found at               http://pfaq.cjb.net but will also be coming soon (twice a month) to a            newsgroup near you…

– HOPS International, Inc. 15105 NW 77th Ave. Miami Lakes, FL 33014 TEL: (305) 8278600 Ext. 230 FAX: (305) 8270999 Before you criticize someone, you should walk a mile in their shoes. That way, when you  criticize them, you’re a mile away and you have their shoes.

Response:

Had two pregnancies with psoriasis, quit ALL medication and topical treatments that included anything stronger than vitamin E and aloe vera for at least 4 months prior to pregnancy.  My derm and family doctor both agreed that would be safe.  Before that, I agressively attacked with anything to get maximum clearance prior to stopping treatments. Pregnancy did not worsen the p, nor did it seem to clear any.  After the births, things flared to the point where I could almost see the lesions grow, but I kept off everything until the babies had at least 4 months of breast feeding. As it was, one child had a minor heart defect and the other allergies. Medication prior to pregnancy may have been a contributing factor. Medication of any type and pregnancy or planning pregnancy do NOT mix.  The baby’s health is worth some temporary suffering. My 2 cents worth. Verna

Response:

Hi’ya Bruce, I’m not a doctor, nor do I have any medical training, nor should anyone ever assume that I’ve got any special insite into any medical issue whatsoever, but… PUVA implies "P"soralin (sp?), and that’s a drug, and it’s taken orally.

Nope, not necessarily. It is also available for topical application, which is commonly used for things like targeting just hands and/or feet and for those who cannot tolerate the side effects.  I have no idea how long it lasts in the body or what effects it might have visa vie a pregnancy, but if it was my wife I would try to encourage her to consider UVA or UVB instead of PUVA (UVB probably being more effective than UVA because of the much longer duration required with UVA)

This isn’t quite accurate either. Conventional med wisdom is that UVA without psoralen is not very effective per se, nothing to do with length of treatment. OTOH some here in the ng have reported some benefit from UVA alone. Also, UVA also carries the much higher concerns about cancer risk than UVB, with or without the psoralen boost, making it not usually worth the reduced benefit without the psoralen. and I would investigate both the Goekerman & Ingram regimes for psoriasis treatment.  These treatments use only topical drugs with extremely low absorbancy characteristics.  They are not very convenient, but are relatively safe.

Maybe. Neither seems to have been tested for effect on pregnant women per what I could dig up at intellihealth and rxlist, while tar at least is still considered a toxic substance. Admittedly they are certainly safer than some other options, including IMO some that are actually considered safe for pregnant women. Just encouraging a bit more caution as safe level of internal absorption for normal adult is not the same as for developing fetus or breastfeeding child. <snip Kim The Psoriasis Newsgroup Resource FAQ can be found at               http://pfaq.cjb.net but will also be coming soon (twice a month) to a            newsgroup near you…

Response:

Thanks for the info Kim, I had no idea psoralin could be used topically.  As for UVA, I’ve had some success with UVA from a tanning bed in the past, but my UVB system works much better… and yes, I’ve read some of that stuff that suggests UVB is not as risky as UVA.  The thing they don’t seem to know is whether it’s psoriacs that have a natural resistance to cancer or if it is the UVB that is less dangerous… and when you think about it, there’s no way any researcher would ever get permission to study that in a double blind test.  (At least not in N.A.; not with the ethical restrictions they enforce today) I guess though, that having a baby & having psoriasis is a challenge that needs to be met very carefully.  Personally, I think the warnings about acitretin are not nearly strong enough.  I personally *believe* that my friend’s baby has a serious heart defect caused by the metabolites of soriatane combined with moderate drinking in the father, being transfered to the mother at or near conception.  The type of heart defect the little boy has is extremely rare, but is reported much more commonly when the mother has ingested tegison (I think that’s the name of the drug that will be produced by combining booze and acitretin… I can’t remember right now.) kob – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi’ya Bruce, I’m not a doctor, nor do I have any medical training, nor should anyone ever assume that I’ve got any special insite into any medical issue whatsoever, but… PUVA implies "P"soralin (sp?), and that’s a drug, and it’s taken orally. Nope, not necessarily. It is also available for topical application, which is commonly used for things like targeting just hands and/or feet and for those who cannot tolerate the side effects.  I have no idea how long it lasts in the body or what effects it might have visa vie a pregnancy, but if it was my wife I would try to encourage her to consider UVA or UVB instead of PUVA (UVB probably being more effective than UVA because of the much longer duration required with UVA) This isn’t quite accurate either. Conventional med wisdom is that UVA without psoralen is not very effective per se, nothing to do with length of treatment. OTOH some here in the ng have reported some benefit from UVA alone. Also, UVA also carries the much higher concerns about cancer risk than UVB, with or without the psoralen boost, making it not usually worth the reduced benefit without the psoralen. and I would investigate both the Goekerman & Ingram regimes for psoriasis treatment.  These treatments use only topical drugs with extremely low absorbancy characteristics.  They are not very convenient, but are relatively safe. Maybe. Neither seems to have been tested for effect on pregnant women per what I could dig up at intellihealth and rxlist, while tar at least is still considered a toxic substance. Admittedly they are certainly safer than some other options, including IMO some that are actually considered safe for pregnant women. Just encouraging a bit more caution as safe level of internal absorption for normal adult is not the same as for developing fetus or breastfeeding child. <snip Kim The Psoriasis Newsgroup Resource FAQ can be found at               http://pfaq.cjb.net but will also be coming soon (twice a month) to a            newsgroup near you…

Response:

I have just double checked the description of Erythrodermic Psoriasis and it is not that severe (I am pretty sure that is not what my wife has, I hope not.The doctor just said Psoriasis, and initially that description matched hers, at least the picture on the web site I was looking at did. I am rambling here, aren’t I?). She has it only on her feet, associated with sever itching. Thanks bruce – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – My wife has just been diagnosed with, I believe Erythrodermic Psoriasis. She has been advised to undergo PUVA treatment. I have done some investigation online but as yet have not found a direct answer to my question. She is planning on trying to fall pregnant in about Dec or Jan next year. Is their any evidence to suggest that this is not a good idea? Any info would be appreciated. Thanks bruce — Before you criticize someone, you should walk a mile in their shoes. That way, when you  criticize them, you’re a mile away and you have their shoes.

– HOPS International, Inc. 15105 NW 77th Ave. Miami Lakes, FL 33014 TEL: (305) 8278600 Ext. 230 FAX: (305) 8270999 Before you criticize someone, you should walk a mile in their shoes. That way, when you  criticize them, you’re a mile away and you have their shoes.

Response:

Hi’ya Bruce, I’m not a doctor, nor do I have any medical training, nor should anyone ever assume that I’ve got any special insite into any medical issue whatsoever, but… PUVA implies "P"soralin (sp?), and that’s a drug, and it’s taken orally.  I have no idea how long it lasts in the body or what effects it might have visa vie a pregnancy, but if it was my wife I would try to encourage her to consider UVA or UVB instead of PUVA (UVB probably being more effective than UVA because of the much longer duration required with UVA) and I would investigate both the Goekerman & Ingram regimes for psoriasis treatment.  These treatments use only topical drugs with extremely low absorbancy characteristics.  They are not very convenient, but are relatively safe. Ask your derm, and once you know what drugs she’ll be taking, consider a consultation with an Internist to assess risk. Also, anecdotally, I’ve heard that many women who become pregnant will experience a remission of their psoriasis while pregnant.  Perhaps there are as many who get worse… but those aren’t well reported under the rubric of "folk cures". Just my $0.02. kob – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I have just double checked the description of Erythrodermic Psoriasis and it is not that severe (I am pretty sure that is not what my wife has, I hope not.The doctor just said Psoriasis, and initially that description matched hers, at least the picture on the web site I was looking at did. I am rambling here, aren’t I?). She has it only on her feet, associated with sever itching. Thanks bruce My wife has just been diagnosed with, I believe Erythrodermic Psoriasis. She has been advised to undergo PUVA treatment. I have done some investigation online but as yet have not found a direct answer to my question. She is planning on trying to fall pregnant in about Dec or Jan next year. Is their any evidence to suggest that this is not a good idea? Any info would be appreciated. Thanks bruce — Before you criticize someone, you should walk a mile in their shoes. That way, when you  criticize them, you’re a mile away and you have their shoes. — HOPS International, Inc. 15105 NW 77th Ave. Miami Lakes, FL 33014 TEL: (305) 8278600 Ext. 230 FAX: (305) 8270999 Before you criticize someone, you should walk a mile in their shoes. That way, when you  criticize them, you’re a mile away and you have their shoes.

Response:

My wife has just been diagnosed with, I believe Erythrodermic Psoriasis. She has been advised to undergo PUVA treatment. I have done some investigation online but as yet have not found a direct answer to my question. She is planning on trying to fall pregnant in about Dec or Jan next year. Is their any evidence to suggest that this is not a good idea? Any info would be appreciated. Thanks bruce — Before you criticize someone, you should walk a mile in their shoes. That way, when you  criticize them, you’re a mile away and you have their shoes.

Response:

Hi Laurie!  Yet again I’m bieng a "me too" but I must agree.  VET!! PRONTO!!

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi everyone I was wondering if anyone can help me, I have a 4 year old Min Pin female and a 7 month old min pin male, which I bought two months ago.  The female went into heat 5 weeks ago and it’s possible that she’s pregnant. Can anybody tell me what the symptoms are. She’s been very temperamental, a clear discharge and she’s shedding allot, she also is panting as though very warm. The people we got her from said she’s only had one litter but could not tell me how many puppies or anything about her heating or how old she was when she had the puppies. Any info would be get. Laurie Larson

Response:

i have just read your question and it is already a few days old . i agree with the other answers, get her to a vet.your bitch may be pregnant or she could have pyometra.this is a very bad uterine infection that  can occur in unspayed bitches after breeding or even just from being in season. i don’t know why pregnancy would make her seem hot. mabey she has a fever. also find out what akc says about registering puppies out of a 7 month old  puppy male!

Response:

I thought that when a dog went into heat they did have a discharge? Is this not true? My sheltie just had her first heat and I noticed a little discharge. But someone who has raised shelties said that that is normal? I am going to post a separate question regarding her. Jane

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – i have just read your question and it is already a few days old . i agree with the other answers, get her to a vet.your bitch may be pregnant or she could have pyometra.this is a very bad uterine infection that  can occur in unspayed bitches after breeding or even just from being in season. i don’t know why pregnancy would make her seem hot. mabey she has a fever. also find out what akc says about registering puppies out of a 7 month old  puppy male!

Response:

Yes, the odds are she is pregnant (unless your male has been castrated). Right now I’d suggest you take her to your vet, to verify whether or not she is in whelp (pregnant) and her general condition.  (the discharge concerns me.)  If she is not pregnant, have her spayed ASAP.  FRom the amount of information you did NOT get from her former owners, one can readily assume they were not the most responsible of breeders, and she is not clear of genetic problems.  FUrther, toy breeds do not necessarily whelp easily. (Hence get in contact with your vet NOW!)  Be prepared for such expenses as a Caesarian section. Anyway, turn off your connection to the Internet, and get on the phone to your vet, fast! avrama

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi everyone I was wondering if anyone can help me, I have a 4 year old Min Pin female and a 7 month old min pin male, which I bought two months ago.  The female went into heat 5 weeks ago and it’s possible that she’s pregnant. Can anybody tell me what the symptoms are. She’s been very temperamental, a clear discharge and she’s shedding allot, she also is panting as though very warm. The people we got her from said she’s only had one litter but could not tell me how many puppies or anything about her heating or how old she was when she had the puppies. Any info would be get. Laurie Larson

Response:

Hi everyone I was wondering if anyone can help me, I have a 4 year old Min Pin female and a 7 month old min pin male, which I bought two months ago.  The female went into heat 5 weeks ago and it’s possible that she’s pregnant. Can anybody tell me what the symptoms are. She’s been very temperamental, a clear discharge and she’s shedding allot, she also is panting as though very warm. The people we got her from said she’s only had one litter but could not tell me how many puppies or anything about her heating or how old she was when she had the puppies. Any info would be get. Laurie Larson

Response:

Thanks all for the info. Greatly appreciated. She has a dermo appointment tomorrow and it will definitely be something she will bring up. Thanks again. bruce – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Thanks for the info Kim, I had no idea psoralin could be used topically.  As for UVA, I’ve had some success with UVA from a tanning bed in the past, but my UVB system works much better… and yes, I’ve read some of that stuff that suggests UVB is not as risky as UVA.  The thing they don’t seem to know is whether it’s psoriacs that have a natural resistance to cancer or if it is the UVB that is less dangerous… and when you think about it, there’s no way any researcher would ever get permission to study that in a double blind test.  (At least not in N.A.; not with the ethical restrictions they enforce today) I guess though, that having a baby & having psoriasis is a challenge that needs to be met very carefully.  Personally, I think the warnings about acitretin are not nearly strong enough.  I personally *believe* that my friend’s baby has a serious heart defect caused by the metabolites of soriatane combined with moderate drinking in the father, being transfered to the mother at or near conception.  The type of heart defect the little boy has is extremely rare, but is reported much more commonly when the mother has ingested tegison (I think that’s the name of the drug that will be produced by combining booze and acitretin… I can’t remember right now.) kob Hi’ya Bruce, I’m not a doctor, nor do I have any medical training, nor should anyone ever assume that I’ve got any special insite into any medical issue whatsoever, but… PUVA implies "P"soralin (sp?), and that’s a drug, and it’s taken orally. Nope, not necessarily. It is also available for topical application, which is commonly used for things like targeting just hands and/or feet and for those who cannot tolerate the side effects.  I have no idea how long it lasts in the body or what effects it might have visa vie a pregnancy, but if it was my wife I would try to encourage her to consider UVA or UVB instead of PUVA (UVB probably being more effective than UVA because of the much longer duration required with UVA) This isn’t quite accurate either. Conventional med wisdom is that UVA without psoralen is not very effective per se, nothing to do with length of treatment. OTOH some here in the ng have reported some benefit from UVA alone. Also, UVA also carries the much higher concerns about cancer risk than UVB, with or without the psoralen boost, making it not usually worth the reduced benefit without the psoralen. and I would investigate both the Goekerman & Ingram regimes for psoriasis treatment.  These treatments use only topical drugs with extremely low absorbancy characteristics.  They are not very convenient, but are relatively safe. Maybe. Neither seems to have been tested for effect on pregnant women per what I could dig up at intellihealth and rxlist, while tar at least is still considered a toxic substance. Admittedly they are certainly safer than some other options, including IMO some that are actually considered safe for pregnant women. Just encouraging a bit more caution as safe level of internal absorption for normal adult is not the same as for developing fetus or breastfeeding child. <snip Kim The Psoriasis Newsgroup Resource FAQ can be found at               http://pfaq.cjb.net but will also be coming soon (twice a month) to a            newsgroup near you…

– HOPS International, Inc. 15105 NW 77th Ave. Miami Lakes, FL 33014 TEL: (305) 8278600 Ext. 230 FAX: (305) 8270999 Before you criticize someone, you should walk a mile in their shoes. That way, when you  criticize them, you’re a mile away and you have their shoes.

Response:

Had two pregnancies with psoriasis, quit ALL medication and topical treatments that included anything stronger than vitamin E and aloe vera for at least 4 months prior to pregnancy.  My derm and family doctor both agreed that would be safe.  Before that, I agressively attacked with anything to get maximum clearance prior to stopping treatments. Pregnancy did not worsen the p, nor did it seem to clear any.  After the births, things flared to the point where I could almost see the lesions grow, but I kept off everything until the babies had at least 4 months of breast feeding. As it was, one child had a minor heart defect and the other allergies. Medication prior to pregnancy may have been a contributing factor. Medication of any type and pregnancy or planning pregnancy do NOT mix.  The baby’s health is worth some temporary suffering. My 2 cents worth. Verna

Response:

Hi’ya Bruce, I’m not a doctor, nor do I have any medical training, nor should anyone ever assume that I’ve got any special insite into any medical issue whatsoever, but… PUVA implies "P"soralin (sp?), and that’s a drug, and it’s taken orally.

Nope, not necessarily. It is also available for topical application, which is commonly used for things like targeting just hands and/or feet and for those who cannot tolerate the side effects.  I have no idea how long it lasts in the body or what effects it might have visa vie a pregnancy, but if it was my wife I would try to encourage her to consider UVA or UVB instead of PUVA (UVB probably being more effective than UVA because of the much longer duration required with UVA)

This isn’t quite accurate either. Conventional med wisdom is that UVA without psoralen is not very effective per se, nothing to do with length of treatment. OTOH some here in the ng have reported some benefit from UVA alone. Also, UVA also carries the much higher concerns about cancer risk than UVB, with or without the psoralen boost, making it not usually worth the reduced benefit without the psoralen. and I would investigate both the Goekerman & Ingram regimes for psoriasis treatment.  These treatments use only topical drugs with extremely low absorbancy characteristics.  They are not very convenient, but are relatively safe.

Maybe. Neither seems to have been tested for effect on pregnant women per what I could dig up at intellihealth and rxlist, while tar at least is still considered a toxic substance. Admittedly they are certainly safer than some other options, including IMO some that are actually considered safe for pregnant women. Just encouraging a bit more caution as safe level of internal absorption for normal adult is not the same as for developing fetus or breastfeeding child. <snip Kim The Psoriasis Newsgroup Resource FAQ can be found at               http://pfaq.cjb.net but will also be coming soon (twice a month) to a            newsgroup near you…

Response:

Thanks for the info Kim, I had no idea psoralin could be used topically.  As for UVA, I’ve had some success with UVA from a tanning bed in the past, but my UVB system works much better… and yes, I’ve read some of that stuff that suggests UVB is not as risky as UVA.  The thing they don’t seem to know is whether it’s psoriacs that have a natural resistance to cancer or if it is the UVB that is less dangerous… and when you think about it, there’s no way any researcher would ever get permission to study that in a double blind test.  (At least not in N.A.; not with the ethical restrictions they enforce today) I guess though, that having a baby & having psoriasis is a challenge that needs to be met very carefully.  Personally, I think the warnings about acitretin are not nearly strong enough.  I personally *believe* that my friend’s baby has a serious heart defect caused by the metabolites of soriatane combined with moderate drinking in the father, being transfered to the mother at or near conception.  The type of heart defect the little boy has is extremely rare, but is reported much more commonly when the mother has ingested tegison (I think that’s the name of the drug that will be produced by combining booze and acitretin… I can’t remember right now.) kob – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi’ya Bruce, I’m not a doctor, nor do I have any medical training, nor should anyone ever assume that I’ve got any special insite into any medical issue whatsoever, but… PUVA implies "P"soralin (sp?), and that’s a drug, and it’s taken orally. Nope, not necessarily. It is also available for topical application, which is commonly used for things like targeting just hands and/or feet and for those who cannot tolerate the side effects.  I have no idea how long it lasts in the body or what effects it might have visa vie a pregnancy, but if it was my wife I would try to encourage her to consider UVA or UVB instead of PUVA (UVB probably being more effective than UVA because of the much longer duration required with UVA) This isn’t quite accurate either. Conventional med wisdom is that UVA without psoralen is not very effective per se, nothing to do with length of treatment. OTOH some here in the ng have reported some benefit from UVA alone. Also, UVA also carries the much higher concerns about cancer risk than UVB, with or without the psoralen boost, making it not usually worth the reduced benefit without the psoralen. and I would investigate both the Goekerman & Ingram regimes for psoriasis treatment.  These treatments use only topical drugs with extremely low absorbancy characteristics.  They are not very convenient, but are relatively safe. Maybe. Neither seems to have been tested for effect on pregnant women per what I could dig up at intellihealth and rxlist, while tar at least is still considered a toxic substance. Admittedly they are certainly safer than some other options, including IMO some that are actually considered safe for pregnant women. Just encouraging a bit more caution as safe level of internal absorption for normal adult is not the same as for developing fetus or breastfeeding child. <snip Kim The Psoriasis Newsgroup Resource FAQ can be found at               http://pfaq.cjb.net but will also be coming soon (twice a month) to a            newsgroup near you…

Response:

I have just double checked the description of Erythrodermic Psoriasis and it is not that severe (I am pretty sure that is not what my wife has, I hope not.The doctor just said Psoriasis, and initially that description matched hers, at least the picture on the web site I was looking at did. I am rambling here, aren’t I?). She has it only on her feet, associated with sever itching. Thanks bruce – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – My wife has just been diagnosed with, I believe Erythrodermic Psoriasis. She has been advised to undergo PUVA treatment. I have done some investigation online but as yet have not found a direct answer to my question. She is planning on trying to fall pregnant in about Dec or Jan next year. Is their any evidence to suggest that this is not a good idea? Any info would be appreciated. Thanks bruce — Before you criticize someone, you should walk a mile in their shoes. That way, when you  criticize them, you’re a mile away and you have their shoes.

– HOPS International, Inc. 15105 NW 77th Ave. Miami Lakes, FL 33014 TEL: (305) 8278600 Ext. 230 FAX: (305) 8270999 Before you criticize someone, you should walk a mile in their shoes. That way, when you  criticize them, you’re a mile away and you have their shoes.

Response:

Hi’ya Bruce, I’m not a doctor, nor do I have any medical training, nor should anyone ever assume that I’ve got any special insite into any medical issue whatsoever, but… PUVA implies "P"soralin (sp?), and that’s a drug, and it’s taken orally.  I have no idea how long it lasts in the body or what effects it might have visa vie a pregnancy, but if it was my wife I would try to encourage her to consider UVA or UVB instead of PUVA (UVB probably being more effective than UVA because of the much longer duration required with UVA) and I would investigate both the Goekerman & Ingram regimes for psoriasis treatment.  These treatments use only topical drugs with extremely low absorbancy characteristics.  They are not very convenient, but are relatively safe. Ask your derm, and once you know what drugs she’ll be taking, consider a consultation with an Internist to assess risk. Also, anecdotally, I’ve heard that many women who become pregnant will experience a remission of their psoriasis while pregnant.  Perhaps there are as many who get worse… but those aren’t well reported under the rubric of "folk cures". Just my $0.02. kob – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I have just double checked the description of Erythrodermic Psoriasis and it is not that severe (I am pretty sure that is not what my wife has, I hope not.The doctor just said Psoriasis, and initially that description matched hers, at least the picture on the web site I was looking at did. I am rambling here, aren’t I?). She has it only on her feet, associated with sever itching. Thanks bruce My wife has just been diagnosed with, I believe Erythrodermic Psoriasis. She has been advised to undergo PUVA treatment. I have done some investigation online but as yet have not found a direct answer to my question. She is planning on trying to fall pregnant in about Dec or Jan next year. Is their any evidence to suggest that this is not a good idea? Any info would be appreciated. Thanks bruce — Before you criticize someone, you should walk a mile in their shoes. That way, when you  criticize them, you’re a mile away and you have their shoes. — HOPS International, Inc. 15105 NW 77th Ave. Miami Lakes, FL 33014 TEL: (305) 8278600 Ext. 230 FAX: (305) 8270999 Before you criticize someone, you should walk a mile in their shoes. That way, when you  criticize them, you’re a mile away and you have their shoes.

Response:

My wife has just been diagnosed with, I believe Erythrodermic Psoriasis. She has been advised to undergo PUVA treatment. I have done some investigation online but as yet have not found a direct answer to my question. She is planning on trying to fall pregnant in about Dec or Jan next year. Is their any evidence to suggest that this is not a good idea? Any info would be appreciated. Thanks bruce — Before you criticize someone, you should walk a mile in their shoes. That way, when you  criticize them, you’re a mile away and you have their shoes.

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Hi Judy- But practising is fun. <g  I had a 34 day cycle–and found myself pregnant with my 2nd child.  They kept rescheduling my ultra sound–so I never had one.  He was 9 pounds 10 1/2 ounces–and they think I was pregnant 10 months.  He is 17 now–wears size 15 1/2 shoes–and is 5 ft 10 inch.  We have NO idea where he came from. LOL Nancy – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – So, I am over two weeks late and decided to take a test last night, came out negative..wonder what the hell is wrong with me.  Sad thing is, I was a little disappointed about the results.

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Yes, he was and IS. LOL  I’m only 5 ft 2in and I weighed 110 when I got pregnant the 2nd time.  I weighed  150 at the end–and could not get lower than 140 for years—then I couldnt swallow–and I went down to 100 in 6 months.  Drs could have cared less.  Turns out I had a goitar on my thyroid (well 2–but one was the problem)–and after two months on thyroid replacement–I could eat again.  I’m back up to 140 <sigh Nancy – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Wow!  That’s a big boy! — -judy Hi Judy- But practising is fun. <g  I had a 34 day cycle–and found myself pregnant with my 2nd child.  They kept rescheduling my ultra sound–so I never had one.  He was 9 pounds 10 1/2 ounces–and they think I was pregnant 10 months.  He is 17 now–wears size 15 1/2 shoes–and is 5 ft 10 inch.  We have NO idea where he came from. LOL Nancy

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So, I am over two weeks late and decided to take a test last night, came out negative..wonder what the hell is wrong with me.  Sad thing is, I was a little disappointed about the results. — -judy *May you have enough happiness to make you sweet, enough trials to make you strong, enough sorrow to keep you human, enough hope to make you happy. *

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Hi judy, Have you been anxious or nervous?  That can make things irregular.  If nothing happens, take another test.  I was pregnant for 5 months with Dustin before the test came back positive! Take Care! Barbie Doll

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – So, I am over two weeks late and decided to take a test last night, came out negative..wonder what the hell is wrong with me.  Sad thing is, I was a little disappointed about the results. — -judy *May you have enough happiness to make you sweet, enough trials to make you strong, enough sorrow to keep you human, enough hope to make you happy. *

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I decided to wait another week and test again, whatever the results happen to be, I am still going to make a doctor’s appointment..it’s time for my annual anyways. Wow, five months!!  That’s crazy! -judy

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi judy, Have you been anxious or nervous?  That can make things irregular.  If nothing happens, take another test.  I was pregnant for 5 months with Dustin before the test came back positive! Take Care! Barbie Doll So, I am over two weeks late and decided to take a test last night, came out negative..wonder what the hell is wrong with me.  Sad thing is, I was a little disappointed about the results. — -judy *May you have enough happiness to make you sweet, enough trials to make you strong, enough sorrow to keep you human, enough hope to make you happy. *

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If at first you dont succeed…… : ) – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – So, I am over two weeks late and decided to take a test last night, came out negative..wonder what the hell is wrong with me.  Sad thing is, I was a little disappointed about the results. — -judy *May you have enough happiness to make you sweet, enough trials to make you strong, enough sorrow to keep you human, enough hope to make you happy. *

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Yeah, it was kinda weird!  But the dr. made me go home and eat, eat, eat… I loved it!  Gained 45 pounds in 4 months!!  Annual..arg!  I hated those!  I don’t have to go anymore, nothing there to check. Barbie

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I decided to wait another week and test again, whatever the results happen to be, I am still going to make a doctor’s appointment..it’s time for my annual anyways. Wow, five months!!  That’s crazy! -judy Hi judy, Have you been anxious or nervous?  That can make things irregular.  If nothing happens, take another test.  I was pregnant for 5 months with Dustin before the test came back positive! Take Care! Barbie Doll So, I am over two weeks late and decided to take a test last night, came out negative..wonder what the hell is wrong with me.  Sad thing is, I was a little disappointed about the results. — -judy *May you have enough happiness to make you sweet, enough trials to make you strong, enough sorrow to keep you human, enough hope to make you happy. *

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Well, we weren’t really trying, no are we, but I guess it was just the whole prospect of it….however, the act is great anyways, regardless!  ;-) -judy – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – If at first you dont succeed…… : ) So, I am over two weeks late and decided to take a test last night, came out negative..wonder what the hell is wrong with me.  Sad thing is, I was a little disappointed about the results. — -judy *May you have enough happiness to make you sweet, enough trials to make you strong, enough sorrow to keep you human, enough hope to make you happy. *

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Hello.  I can’t help with your question, I just wanted to welcome you to the group!  mgbio – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi, am new to the group, however have found it to be most helpful and reassuring. I am looking for some advice….have had UC for 5 years, been in remission for 2.  Am currently taking Sulphasalazine, Co-Proxamol, Naproxen (to ease the arthritis) and Omaprazole (to ease the naproxen). I was diagnosed about 8 months after the birth of my first child, but am now really wanting another. I’m sure that others have successfully had children with UC, but, have u stayed on the painkillers, how has it affected you etc??? Any help would be appreciated…… TIA.

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<<I’m sure that others have successfully had children with UC, but, have u stayed on the painkillers, how has it affected you etc??? I have had three children while taking six Asacol a day, and nursed all three, but I haven’t had any experience taking painkillers.  I’m sorry I can’t be more helpful to your situation.  My UC has been in remission for over eight years and my children are aged six, four, and eight weeks, so you can see that the UC hasn’t really been an issue in pregnancy. I wish you all the best with your plans. Mary Ellen

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Seems I read somewhere in the last two or three days about pregnancy making the symptoms go away until after birth?  I know I had no problems with mine when Iw as pregnant, then it came back within a few months.  I wouldn’t take any pain pills other than your OB prescribes.  Hope this helps.  HUGS~ Jennifer

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hello.  I can’t help with your question, I just wanted to welcome you to the group!  mgbio Hi, am new to the group, however have found it to be most helpful and reassuring. I am looking for some advice….have had UC for 5 years, been in remission for 2.  Am currently taking Sulphasalazine, Co-Proxamol, Naproxen (to ease the arthritis) and Omaprazole (to ease the naproxen). I was diagnosed about 8 months after the birth of my first child, but am now really wanting another. I’m sure that others have successfully had children with UC, but, have u stayed on the painkillers, how has it affected you etc??? Any help would be appreciated…… TIA.

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Hi, am new to the group, however have found it to be most helpful and reassuring. I am looking for some advice….have had UC for 5 years, been in remission for 2.  Am currently taking Sulphasalazine, Co-Proxamol, Naproxen (to ease the arthritis) and Omaprazole (to ease the naproxen). I was diagnosed about 8 months after the birth of my first child, but am now really wanting another. I’m sure that others have successfully had children with UC, but, have u stayed on the painkillers, how has it affected you etc??? Any help would be appreciated…… TIA.

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Paula: Sorry this follow-up is so late. I just read the original question. I had a baby girl a year and a half ago. I did get pregnant during a slight flare up. Most doctors advise against this. Even though some people experience a remission of symptoms due to pregnancy hormones (so it’s thought) this benefit usually doesn’t kick in until the second trimester. I was on prednisone when I became pregnant and it masked the initial symptoms of a serious fistula and abcess. They were able to get rid of the problem with IV antibiotics but after the baby was born I had to have a resection. Also watch out if you’re taking Asacol while pregnant. It’s believed to be safe for the fetus, but it can have some of the same side effects as aspirin: Overdue delivery, prolonged or non-progressing labor. After 50 hours of induced labor I finally ended up having a C-section. After they got rid of the abcess (at the end of the first trimester) the pregnancy went well. I did get that 2nd & 3rd trimester symptom remission. I was also lucky that I did not have a post-partum flare up. Good luck. Dana Koay

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Hi, My name is Paula. I’m 27. I’ve had cd for 14 years and several major surgeries. I have no colon left, an ileostomy and I recently had more removed. I’ve been married for almost four years and my biological clock is starting to go haywire. I would like to have kids but I really want to hear from other who have had cd or uc and their experiences with pregnancy. I’m not even certain if it’s a possibility after all the complications I have had from my operations and disease, but please tell me your experiences.

Hi Paula! Nice to see you back, you’ve been kind of quiet for a while. I see you now have a Prodigy address – don’t you work in the newsroom anymore? Anyway, to your question … as you may remember, I am pregnant right now (I’m at 31.5 weeks). I have ulcerative colitis, and I’ll be 34 next month. Is it better to wait until a flare is over? What happens if I get pregnant during a flare?

You’ve got a reasonable chance that the flare will improve, actually. The hormones your body is flooded with when you are pregnant act like immunosuppressants (to keep you from rejecting the foetus). OTOH, being pregnant is hard work – it is a good idea to be in as good shape as you can be. If you think a flare is dying down, maybe you should wait. OTOH (third hand? 8-)), if you are concerned about your ability to get pregnant, then don’t wait, just do it. In any case, if necessary, prednisone is safe to use during pregnancy. Since I throw up a lot anyways will morning sickness be a killer or what?

No way to tell. I didn’t have any morning sickness to speak of. Other people with perfectly healthy digestive systems were as sick as dogs. I wouldn’t worry about it. However, now that the baby is starting to squish my innards out of the way, I do notice some problems. I get nauseated sometimes, have some trouble passing stuff and the bleeding has increased slightly. But so far nothing serious. There are others on this group who have already had babies – I’m sure they will be glad to respond to you. Be well, Hadass — National Research Council of Canada             Phone: (204) 984 – 4535 Institute for Biodiagnostics                    Fax:   (204) 984 – 5472 435 Ellice Avenue, Winnipeg, MB, R3B 1Y6        http://www.ibd.nrc.ca/~eviatar Obligatory disclaimer: NRC wouldn’t dream of saying a thing like that.

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Hi, My name is Paula. I’m 27. I’ve had cd for 14 years and several major surgeries. I have no colon left, an ileostomy and I recently had more removed. I’ve been married for almost four years and my biological clock is starting to go haywire. I would like to have kids but I really want to hear from other who have had cd or uc and their experiences with pregnancy. I’m not even certain if it’s a possibility after all the complications I have had from my operations and disease, but please tell me your experiences. Is it better to wait until a flare is over? What happens if I get pregnant during a flare? Since I throw up a lot anyways will morning sickness be a killer or what? Paula

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Dear Paula,    If you would like some information on pregnancy & IBD, just e-mail us your home address.  We would be happy to send it to you.  Our e-mail    I noticed you have PRODIGY.  The Crohn’s & Colitis Foundation has a Forum on the PRODIGY service.  Just [JUMP] "CCFA" to access the Forum.   We have numerous articles on IBD.  There is an article on pregnancy & IBD in the Library section of the Forum.  It is under the topic "Coping" and the subject "Family Matters."    If you have any questions regarding the Forum, please feel free to contact us. Deborah Moy Online Systems Assistant Crohn’s & Colitis Foundation

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Since one year my fiance has problems with her bowel. The doctor diagnosted UC. May be this was a little too early, because he only has a look to the symtoms, but not to the protocol which was made during a colonoscopy. This protocol says, that there is no hint for an UC. Before this we spoke about having children and being pregnant. Now she is very down, because she think, that it is impossible to have children while taking Mesalazin (Salofalk). Is there anyone who has experience in having children with UC ? Which steps we should take to fix the diagnose ? Thanks a lot. Dirk.

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If you would like reading material on pregnancy & IBD, please e-mail us If you have any questions, please don’t hesitate to ask. Debbie Moy Online Systems Assistant Crohn’s & Colitis Foundation of America [CCFA]

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Many women here with UC (including myself) have had normal pregnancies and healthy babies while on some kind of medication.  In my case, Asacol.  I would encourage your fiancee to get the CCFA publications.   Also, a good book is The Angry Gut, by W. Grant Thompson, M.D.  (Typing from memory, hope that’s exactly right.) MESSAGE TO SUE: I haven’t checked the FAQ lately, but if there’s no reference to pregnancy and lactation with IBD, maybe something could be added?  This question comes up every few weeks.  Thanks. Mary Ellen

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Many women here with UC (including myself) have had normal pregnancies and healthy babies while on some kind of medication.  In my case, Asacol.  I would encourage your fiancee to get the CCFA publications.   Also, a good book is The Angry Gut, by W. Grant Thompson, M.D.  (Typing from memory, hope that’s exactly right.) MESSAGE TO SUE: I haven’t checked the FAQ lately, but if there’s no reference to pregnancy and lactation with IBD, maybe something could be added?  This question comes up every few weeks.  Thanks. Mary Ellen

Excellent idea!  I will email the doctor who wrote the last draft about this, but IMHO this section should be written by someone who has gone thru pregnancy with IBD and on meds.  The section should also include info on degree of activity of the illness during pregnancy and immediately thereafter.  If anyone feels she’s knowledgeable enough about all this, and would like the fame, fortune, and miscellaneous happy feelings connected with drafting a section of a FAQ (well, 2 out of 3, anyway!), please email me.  I will get back to the group in a week with a progress report.

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we were wondering about pregnancy.

Ed, It’s hard to tell in advance how your wife’s disease will react during pregnancy.  Mine actually improved while I was pg and then worsened after birth.  My CD affected my ability to get pg and was only able to do so with in vitro (because of scar tissue from bowel surgeries).  Anyway the pregnancy was a breeze compared to raising this rambunctious 3 yr old.  Mind you I am not complaining.  I love her dearly and would not trade one minute of it.  However, my illness and energy levels certainly have taking a beating trying to keep up with her.  I say that if you want children, go for it. Lori

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i never spoke before but have been reading your postings……i dont have crohns.  i have a condition called collagen colitus  it as the same symptoms of crohns   i went down to 85 lbs and had double over cramps and diarreah    i have had 4 children and did okay    the hardest part was keeping a weight gain     it can be acheived with meds that wont pass on to the baby      good luck

Lets look for shooting stars together!!

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Hello, My name is Ed and my soon-to-be wife has crohns disease and we were wondering about pregnancy.  We are both very excited to start our life together, and for the first time in both of our lives we look forward to the possibility of raising children.  However, there have been several days to where she could not wear nylons, or even have the button on her pants buttoned because of all the cramping and pain in her stomach.  This friday she is going to the doctor to see what she may be able to do in the future as far as children (probably about 2 years in the future), but I was hoping somebody out there could help me with some insight on the possibility of it. We have no qualms about adopting, as she herself was adopted we plan to in the future anyways, but we would still like to have one or two of our own. If you could help me I would be most appreciative.  Please send replies to

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I am 31 years old and have had RA for 11 years.  I currently take 15mg of methotrexate, plaquenil, and arthrotec.  I know after talking to my Doctor that I would have to go off all of my medication.  She did say it was safe to take prednisone while trying to get pregnant and then would take me off it once I was pregnant.  She has not had a RA patient go through a pregnancy and is worried about it.  I could not see any terrible side effect besides possibly a large baby, miscarriage, or gestational diabetes.  These could happen with a healthy person.  I do know that there would be a chance that my child could have RA but no one in my family had this disease.  I would like to know if anyone has had a child and what kind of medications you were on and if you had any complications.  Thanks.

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Hi!  I don’t have children but I’m trying to get pregnant.  There are actually quite a few of us here on this ng who are or have been in a similar situation. I’m 25 and went off MTX.  I’m currently on 5mg prednisone and 1800mg ibuprofen.  When I get pregnant, I’ll taper off the meds.  No one in my family had RA so I’m not real concerned about my children having it.  Of course we would love to not be on any meds but when you don’t have a choice, prednisone looks pretty good.   Is your doctor a rheumatologist?  I’m wondering why she has not had any RA mothers.  There are a lot of women with RA who successfully have children. Good luck to you and please let us know of your progress. Margie

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I was told on the 8th of July, that you must be off of MTX for at least 2 months previous to the pregnancy. This applies to both the male and female!! He (Dr.) didn’t go into great detail about what would happen but I assume that it should be a major concern, mainly  about birth defects!!!         Dave Arrowood darro2

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I was told on the 8th of July, that you must be off of MTX for at least 2 months previous to the pregnancy. This applies to both the male and female!! He (Dr.) didn’t go into great detail about what would happen but I assume that it should be a major concern, mainly  about birth defects!!!

I have a male friend who was on MTX, his wife got pregnant and it ended with a miscarriage. They attributed that to his MTX use. Keep Smilin’ ~krissy "The most thoroughly wasted of all days is that  in which one has not laughed." Nicolas Chamfort

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I was told on the 8th of July, that you must be off of MTX for at least 2 months previous to the pregnancy. This applies to both the male and female!! He (Dr.) didn’t go into great detail about what would happen but I assume that it should be a major concern, mainly  about birth defects!!!

MTX is one of the active drugs in the abortion pill.  Alone it can cause spontaneous abortion or severe birth defects. Margie

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Hi Preferred Customer, I am 41 years old and have had RA for 21 years.  I have had two children. Both born premature.  With both I stopped all meds…my choice.  I had both of them naturally though my daughter was induced since I was suffering from toxima (she was my second and last).  With my first (my son) I went into total remission and felt great.  With my daughter I suffered complications during the whole time.  They are 13 and 8 and are doing great.  They are my joy and also my worry. I worked with an OB/GYN that worked closely with my RD.  They actually went to school together and golfed together.  I think he saved my daughter and my life.  He was concerned about my hips, but they seemed to work fine. After both prenancies, I had a lot of support from my husband and with my daughter from my mother-in-law. Good luck, Lori V. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I am 31 years old and have had RA for 11 years.  I currently take 15mg of methotrexate, plaquenil, and arthrotec.  I know after talking to my Doctor that I would have to go off all of my medication.  She did say it was safe to take prednisone while trying to get pregnant and then would take me off it once I was pregnant.  She has not had a RA patient go through a pregnancy and is worried about it.  I could not see any terrible side effect besides possibly a large baby, miscarriage, or gestational diabetes.  These could happen with a healthy person.  I do know that there would be a chance that my child could have RA but no one in my family had this disease.  I would like to know if anyone has had a child and what kind of medications you were on and if you had any complications.  Thanks.

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I’m just beginning to try to conceive. I’m 27 and have hadJRA since age three, but serious since 14. See if your rheum can talk with another rheum who has treated pregnant women. There is not much data out there for meds and pregnancy, but there are a few case study reports. All dr.’s aggree that the mtx is not good for pregnancy. The time frame for stopping it is 1-6 months before conceiving, depending on how liberal your dr. is. We chose 3 months. The plaquenil is highly debateable. Some rheums feel it is totally safe throughout pregnancy. Mine does not, and neither did I. I stopped it at three months as well. As for the pred., studies have shown that it is safe to be used throughout pregnancy. My dr. says under 10mg. I have not needed to go on it yet, but once I concieve, and have to stop the nsaids, I’m sure I will need the pred. Nsaids shouldn’t be used during pregnancy, particularly the last trimester. It appears that women with RA don’t have an increased risk during pregnancy. About 80% go into remission. Nice odds. I’ve heard it’s less for JRA and other arthritis (60%?). One problem that arises is your range of motion of damaged joints, and your stamina, both of wich can affect how comfortable you are carrying in the last months and then also the delivery. A large number of women will flare sometime between 6wks and 3 months after birth, so that can be a bummer to watch for. Makes it harder to care for the newborn. And breastfeeding tends to be cut short, by having to go back on DMARDS. BTW, last count, I think there were 5 of us looking to become pregnant. So if you have additional questions, post away. Good luck!! —Ali life is what happens when you’re making other plans…

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I am 31 years old and have had RA for 11 years.  I currently take 15mg of methotrexate, plaquenil, and arthrotec.  I know after talking to my Doctor that I would have to go off all of my medication.  She did say it was safe to take prednisone while trying to get pregnant and then would take me off it once I was pregnant.  She has not had a RA patient go through a pregnancy and is worried about it.  I could not see any terrible side effect besides possibly a large baby, miscarriage, or gestational diabetes.  These could happen with a healthy person.  I do know that there would be a chance that my child could have RA but no one in my family had this disease.  I would like to know if anyone has had a child and what kind of medications you were on and if you had any complications.  Thanks.

Response:

Hi!  I don’t have children but I’m trying to get pregnant.  There are actually quite a few of us here on this ng who are or have been in a similar situation. I’m 25 and went off MTX.  I’m currently on 5mg prednisone and 1800mg ibuprofen.  When I get pregnant, I’ll taper off the meds.  No one in my family had RA so I’m not real concerned about my children having it.  Of course we would love to not be on any meds but when you don’t have a choice, prednisone looks pretty good.   Is your doctor a rheumatologist?  I’m wondering why she has not had any RA mothers.  There are a lot of women with RA who successfully have children. Good luck to you and please let us know of your progress. Margie

Response:

I was told on the 8th of July, that you must be off of MTX for at least 2 months previous to the pregnancy. This applies to both the male and female!! He (Dr.) didn’t go into great detail about what would happen but I assume that it should be a major concern, mainly  about birth defects!!!         Dave Arrowood darro2

Response:

I was told on the 8th of July, that you must be off of MTX for at least 2 months previous to the pregnancy. This applies to both the male and female!! He (Dr.) didn’t go into great detail about what would happen but I assume that it should be a major concern, mainly  about birth defects!!!

I have a male friend who was on MTX, his wife got pregnant and it ended with a miscarriage. They attributed that to his MTX use. Keep Smilin’ ~krissy "The most thoroughly wasted of all days is that  in which one has not laughed." Nicolas Chamfort

Response:

I was told on the 8th of July, that you must be off of MTX for at least 2 months previous to the pregnancy. This applies to both the male and female!! He (Dr.) didn’t go into great detail about what would happen but I assume that it should be a major concern, mainly  about birth defects!!!

MTX is one of the active drugs in the abortion pill.  Alone it can cause spontaneous abortion or severe birth defects. Margie

Response:

Hi Preferred Customer, I am 41 years old and have had RA for 21 years.  I have had two children. Both born premature.  With both I stopped all meds…my choice.  I had both of them naturally though my daughter was induced since I was suffering from toxima (she was my second and last).  With my first (my son) I went into total remission and felt great.  With my daughter I suffered complications during the whole time.  They are 13 and 8 and are doing great.  They are my joy and also my worry. I worked with an OB/GYN that worked closely with my RD.  They actually went to school together and golfed together.  I think he saved my daughter and my life.  He was concerned about my hips, but they seemed to work fine. After both prenancies, I had a lot of support from my husband and with my daughter from my mother-in-law. Good luck, Lori V. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I am 31 years old and have had RA for 11 years.  I currently take 15mg of methotrexate, plaquenil, and arthrotec.  I know after talking to my Doctor that I would have to go off all of my medication.  She did say it was safe to take prednisone while trying to get pregnant and then would take me off it once I was pregnant.  She has not had a RA patient go through a pregnancy and is worried about it.  I could not see any terrible side effect besides possibly a large baby, miscarriage, or gestational diabetes.  These could happen with a healthy person.  I do know that there would be a chance that my child could have RA but no one in my family had this disease.  I would like to know if anyone has had a child and what kind of medications you were on and if you had any complications.  Thanks.

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I’m just beginning to try to conceive. I’m 27 and have hadJRA since age three, but serious since 14. See if your rheum can talk with another rheum who has treated pregnant women. There is not much data out there for meds and pregnancy, but there are a few case study reports. All dr.’s aggree that the mtx is not good for pregnancy. The time frame for stopping it is 1-6 months before conceiving, depending on how liberal your dr. is. We chose 3 months. The plaquenil is highly debateable. Some rheums feel it is totally safe throughout pregnancy. Mine does not, and neither did I. I stopped it at three months as well. As for the pred., studies have shown that it is safe to be used throughout pregnancy. My dr. says under 10mg. I have not needed to go on it yet, but once I concieve, and have to stop the nsaids, I’m sure I will need the pred. Nsaids shouldn’t be used during pregnancy, particularly the last trimester. It appears that women with RA don’t have an increased risk during pregnancy. About 80% go into remission. Nice odds. I’ve heard it’s less for JRA and other arthritis (60%?). One problem that arises is your range of motion of damaged joints, and your stamina, both of wich can affect how comfortable you are carrying in the last months and then also the delivery. A large number of women will flare sometime between 6wks and 3 months after birth, so that can be a bummer to watch for. Makes it harder to care for the newborn. And breastfeeding tends to be cut short, by having to go back on DMARDS. BTW, last count, I think there were 5 of us looking to become pregnant. So if you have additional questions, post away. Good luck!! —Ali life is what happens when you’re making other plans…

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I live in Petawawa, ON and I am looking for an asthma specialist in Ottawa. Do any of you live in that area and are able to recommend a doctor?  Also, if anyone lives in the Pembroke area and can recommend a good family doctor that would be great.  I have just moved to this area from BC. Thanks in advance, Meghan

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Okay Meghan This is hardly in your area…but if you need a fabulous asthma specialist and are willing to travel to Toronto, Ont. I can recommend one. Vicky let me know, the one we have is just FABULOUS! – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I live in Petawawa, ON and I am looking for an asthma specialist in Ottawa. Do any of you live in that area and are able to recommend a doctor?  Also, if anyone lives in the Pembroke area and can recommend a good family doctor that would be great.  I have just moved to this area from BC. Thanks in advance, Meghan

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